- Sep 8, 2020
- Reaction score
Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: dreamtimeDate: 2018-12-28 14:12:01Reaction Score: 26
I wrote this a while ago on Reddit:For right now I do think that the majority of the medieval knights were some sort of pro-sportsmen, rather than soldiers. We allegedly have this thing called hastilude, which was a generic term used in the Middle Ages to refer to many kinds of martial games. One of those martial games was jousting:
Intriguingly, there is one element in a medieval battle which is rarely mentioned in contemporary accounts – what happened to the dead of both sides.
To date, it has proved impossible to find at Azincourt the burial pit described by Monstrelet, or indeed any bodies at all.
In 1818, when British troops controlled the area in the aftermath of the Napoleonic wars, Lieutenant Colonel John Woodford claimed to have found human remains at the battlefield. We even have a map which he drew up where he marked ‘the place of interment of 5800 French knights’. Yet archaeological survey (...) failed to reveal anything.
Modern archaeologists have so far drawn a blank in finding human remains at virtually all English and French battlefields of the fourteenth and fifteenth centuries
Hans Jakob Christoffel von Grimmelshausen was either a veteran of the 30 Years War or at least heard a lot of stories from veterans. He wrote one of the first novels in early modern German, where the protagonists mocks pikemen thus:Therefore I believe that he who kills a pikeman (that he could have spared), murders an innocent [...] as they never hurt anybody who didn't deserve it by running onto the spit by himself. In Summary, I have seen many sharp occasions, but hardly ever percieved that a pikeman killed somebody.
Mike Duncan says this in his revolutions podcast (English civil war) so that might have been it. More specifically that it was more about shoving than stabbing and that often only one side really tried and the other was happy to give token resistance the withdraw. The awkward cases were where both side were trying to do the latter and they may have actually stayed just out of range trying to look like they were fighting
Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: anotherlayerDate: 2018-12-28 14:46:12Reaction Score: 7
This first word "Xnders"(whatever it says) also appears in the middle of the second name. Might that be some sort of role? Perhaps denoting these dudes as a jockey or striker?
The Battle of Hastings - 1066 Norman Invasion - is my favorite for a seemingly nonexistent battle. The museum was closed down that was located on the original battlefield once it became obvious it was somewhere else.Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: tupperawareDate: 2018-12-28 17:27:41Reaction Score: 8
There is some info on the 1440 no casualties battle of AnghiariNote: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: KorbenDallasDate: 2018-12-28 19:42:49Reaction Score: 3
I see Yndrrs Resmidmor (Xcsmidmor?) and Noetr Yndrrs Lincks, but admittedly its a bit like looking at a shrink's ink blotsNote: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: trismegistusDate: 2018-12-28 20:42:03Reaction Score: 2
Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: Deleted_x7Date: 2018-12-28 22:43:12Reaction Score: 8
Ive read somewhere (dont recall where ATM, maybe here) that a 'hooked X' was actually the first letter of the AlphaBet. so this may have also been written like that?Closest I can get would be 'Xnders DeSmidmor' and his lovely wife, 'Rolff Xnders Linds'.
Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: PrincepAugusDate: 2019-02-02 05:44:40Reaction Score: 1
I remember this post when watching this video. It's a mainstream "explanation" of missing bodies:I wrote this a while ago on Reddit:
I have the rough idea in mind that bloody wars are a relatively new thing, and evolved from something less serious. I don't think that history was without violence and people killing each other, but that bigger battles originally had certain rules to it that made the chance of dying relatively low and the chance of getting hurt reasonable. Maybe there was the possibility of death, but it wasn't as hopeless as portraied by historians. So instead of casualties in the realms of 10-100% it could have been more like 0-1%. Originally I thought about this because even in WW1 soldiers were basically faking the fights, and often miss their enemy consciously. Only in WW2 with the help of numbing drugs was this brotherly and humane behavior eliminated. Additionally most theories about ancient conflicts and battles are not supported by archeologists finding all those killed bodies, but by circumstantial evidence., i.e. later reports. I think even such reports may have been part of the "storyline", i.e. the winner exaggerating to create sympathy and pride for the war heroes in their populace. Then historians mis-interpreted these reports without knowing the true context. I think what is supportive of this idea is the growing evidence that natural catastrophes of some sort and famines probably killed most people during the last centuries, and not wars. Overall I think human conflicts may have begun as different factions only signaling their strength, and all involved parties honoring rules what would nowadays be interpreted as game rules. After some time with the rise of authoritarian kingdoms these games turned into something more bloody, but still manageable (i.e. people still went to war happily, because the chances of surviving were extremely good and winners would come home to a big party). I knew from my research that no one has excavated a single mass grave from the 30-Years War. I wondered if anyone in the professional field has already thought about the problems of finding archeological evidence for battle sites in general, and this is indeed the case. In fact, a paper I found discusses these problems.
And indeed the archeological evidence for battle sites is almost non-existent:
Apparently medieval descriptions from the burial of the dead after the battle of Morat in 1476 aren't supported by any archeological evidence:
No dead people from the Napoleonic wars either:
Actually no evidence at all for dead people:
These quotes send shivers down my spine because it confirms that the version of history that the majority of people believe in is an illusion and we are onto something here with the idea of humanity having a more worthy past.
All in all I think reports of battles are a mix of truth, myths, lies and exaggeration and often include the loss of life that happened due to cataclysms and natural catastrophes, whatever they were exactly.
Look at the below thread where it pertains to the Battle of Anghiari:Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: KorbenDallasDate: 2019-02-02 05:49:50Reaction Score: 1
I have not been successful in tracking much down on these names:Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: MabzynnDate: 2020-01-03 13:28:07Reaction Score: 5
Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: in cahootsDate: 2020-01-03 23:52:07Reaction Score: 5
Changis? That's the Mongolian pronunciation of "Genghis", as in Genghis Khan (which is a title, not a name, and refers to a person who probably never existed, but let's bear this out). Weirdly, the abbreviation to "Cham" also closely resembles the "Khan" we find included in the anglicized name. "Khan" being a widespread word (czar/tsar, caeser, kaiser, king, xan) of ambiguous 3rd-century origin among the Xiongnu, and then the Gokturks. The title "resurges" to prominence in 13th-century with Temujin andhis alleged sons.Gold has a sand owl. The Tartars took this bird for the arms of their Empire, in recognition and memory of the fact that Changis their first Emperor, whom they call the great Cham, was saved by means of such a bird, and yet many believe that the owl is an ominous bird, symbol of misfortune, infelicity, misery, and death; this is why those who wish to represent the bad omens preach an owl...
I don’t really have anything concrete to add to this thread. However, I find the subject very interesting, especially with regard to the missing bodies issue. I was recently looking into Indian ‘history’ and found that apparently, during the middle ages, Muslim invasions have accounted for over 60 million deaths. When you add that figure to the casualties of all the other conflicts, catastrophes and plagues that were supposed to be going on, were there really enough people about?Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: FelixnoilleDate: 2020-01-05 11:12:17Reaction Score: 6
I wanted to break this down a bit further because there's some really interesting other images in the book Korben:Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: MabzynnDate: 2020-01-06 17:43:46Reaction Score: 3
Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: jd755Date: 2020-01-06 18:43:25Reaction Score: 0
Owl aka Phoenix?Gold Owl burning over fire
Naked cherub on a hobby horse.naked guy with wings riding a horse head on a stick?
Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: TimeshifterDate: 2020-01-06 18:54:47Reaction Score: 1
Is that another one of those none human, alien/ hibrid suits of armour again?I wanted to break this down a bit further because there's some really interesting other images in the book Korben:
Hapsburg black and yellow with a Gold Owl burning over fire.... (hmmm)
View attachment 37721
More Tartary next to a naked guy with wings riding a horse head on a stick?
View attachment 37722
Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: MabzynnDate: 2020-01-06 19:27:14Reaction Score: 3
There's a whole bunch of weird stuff that doesn't fit a Catholic nation. Bunch of Moor's competed as well. Then one guy at the end who just didn't feel like getting dressed up which made me laugh. Literally couldn't find a single thing that appeared Christian to me.
To be fair, there are crosses on this poor horse,Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: jd755Date: 2020-01-06 19:53:04Reaction Score: 2
Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: MabzynnDate: 2020-01-06 20:49:56Reaction Score: 1
I'm not so sure a bird represents Christianity, but if those are indeed crosses and not just a random pattern on the horse that is a very sad way for Christianity to be represented at this period. lolTo be fair, there are crosses on this poor horse,
and a heathcock on this one
but this one brings the whole 'dating' into question as these black briefs appear very 20th century to me and that bath very 19th century.
Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: StarmonkeyDate: 2020-01-06 20:53:51Reaction Score: 0
Tilting reptilians? Sleestaks?
Note: This post was recovered from the Sh.org archive.Username: 0harris0Date: 2020-01-06 21:37:57Reaction Score: 1
I would describe those owls' colours as Sable, the tartarian is described, "Gold, with Sable Owl"Hapsburg black and yellow with a Gold Owl burning over fire.... (hmmm)