# What is the financial situation for the website?



## Potato (Dec 24, 2020)

I just experienced another forum shut-down. This made me think about this site which has just been resurrected from the dead and I'm curious, who is footing the bill for this place? I clicked on the donation page and it says there have been no donations. It doesn't give any information about what your costs are or what the need is. Can you fill us in? Who is paying for it so far? How long do we have before we are threatened with another shut-down for lack of funds?


----------



## 6079SmithW (Dec 24, 2020)

Donated.

I hope others do the same, even if it's a few bucks


----------



## dreamtime (Dec 24, 2020)

it’s around 40$ per month currently, expected to go up over time with increased traffic.


----------



## Chince (Dec 24, 2020)

are we meeting that 'target' of 40$ a month currently? and is there a way to possibly keep that ratio up-to-date? like if costs suddenly increase with traffic - would the team notify the community in some way? This approach could come off as negative depending on how its handled but im more concerned about making sure the site is atleast financially stable.

Thanks for all the efforts staff team - i know lots of us are willing to help chip in


----------



## Potato (Dec 24, 2020)

dreamtime said:


> it’s around 40$ per month currently, expected to go up over time with increased traffic.


Really? That's significantly lower than I expected, although granted I know nothing about running a website. Now I'm befuddled about why the other site shut down after so many people offered to send money. Thanks, good to know we won't be closed down any time soon.

Thanks again to all you guys that have volunteered your time for us.


----------



## Citezenship (Dec 24, 2020)

Tried to donate but not working for me.

Any help??


----------



## luddite (Dec 24, 2020)

6079SmithW said:


> Donated.
> 
> I hope others do the same, even if it's a few bucks


Thank you @6079SmithW ! It really is appreciated! You are the second who donated so far. The donations addon doesn't show the total of past donations unfortunately.



Potato said:


> I'm curious, who is footing the bill for this place? I clicked on the donation page and it says there have been no donations. It doesn't give any information about what your costs are or what the need is. Can you fill us in? Who is paying for it so far? How long do we have before we are threatened with another shut-down for lack of funds?



Hi @Potato , we should update that page regarding costs. Thankfully the hosting costs are reasonable as dreamtime mentioned above however during the resurrection @pushamaku invested weeks of effort into importing the archived content, I set up the server and system (less work that pushamaku but still considerable) and our mods have worked tirelessly making sure that everything is running smoothly. So far @pushamaku covers the SMTP email costs and I cover the hosting of sh.net and @dreamtime covers the German server costs. . However our first donation covered off 2 months of hosting costs which I was very thankful for.

Any further donations would go to email service costs and then hosting and finally to the mods.

It would be nice to have no outgoings of course and provide a stipend for @staff as it is a major time sink on a daily basis not to mention it can be quite draining dealing with drama.

We now have off-server storage for backups  thanks to @edavrio which is a huge help also.

In summary, we did this because we love it but we definitely appreciate any help!


----------



## dreamtime (Dec 24, 2020)

yeah the true costs aren’t financial in nature currently. there’s a lot of time and effort going into this behind the scenes.


----------



## Chince (Dec 24, 2020)

If and when it does decide to become a financial problem - definitely let us know


----------



## Citezenship (Dec 24, 2020)

dreamtime said:


> yeah the true costs aren’t financial in nature currently. there’s a lot of time and effort going into this behind the scenes.


----------



## luddite (Dec 24, 2020)

Citezenship said:


> dreamtime said:
> 
> 
> > yeah the true costs aren’t financial in nature currently. there’s a lot of time and effort going into this behind the scenes.
> ...


I'll pm you the details whilst we investigate this issue. It won't be fixed until after Christmas as no laptop time for me today!


----------



## Citezenship (Dec 24, 2020)

luddite said:


> Citezenship said:
> 
> 
> > dreamtime said:
> ...


No worries, no rush, there is donation from me ready to go and will donate more as and when i can!


----------



## Chince (Dec 24, 2020)

The paypal option worked great for me - i just had to make sure to click on the 'donate' button next to the 'watch' thread button. I would guess its on paypals end if mine worked
edit: pmed Citizenship but midaswell post this to make it known


----------



## Citezenship (Dec 24, 2020)

Chince said:


> The paypal option worked great for me - i just had to make sure to click on the 'donate' button next to the 'watch' thread button. I would guess its on paypals end if mine worked


It did work once for me, however i was interrupted by a phone call before i could complete and when i tried again i got the above msg.


----------



## dreamtime (Dec 26, 2020)

Potato said:


> Really? That's significantly lower than I expected, although granted I know nothing about running a website.



I think most of these web projects require a lot of money because time is limited and those who are involved expect to get something in return for what they do, and often they actually need something in return to be able to afford working on it. Then they come out and say something like „our server costs are 500$ per month“ because when they say „our technical costs are 50$ but we also need money to survive“ no one wants to help.

I've now set up an donation goal of 50$ per month to give members an idea of how much is needed to cover costs.



Chince said:


> are we meeting that 'target' of 40$ a month currently?



As far as I remember, we only had one donation until today.


----------



## TurpinHero (Dec 27, 2020)

Citezenship said:


> dreamtime said:
> 
> 
> > yeah the true costs aren’t financial in nature currently. there’s a lot of time and effort going into this behind the scenes.
> ...


Exactly the same error message I received last week. Frustrating.


----------



## luddite (Dec 27, 2020)

TurpinHero said:


> Citezenship said:
> 
> 
> > dreamtime said:
> ...


Very strange. We don't control PayPal but if you do a direct gift to our PayPal email - "stolenhistory.net at gmail.com" - then it will work.


----------



## JWW427 (Jan 4, 2021)

Ill try that with PayPal.
Got it!


----------



## Citezenship (Jan 4, 2021)

luddite said:


> TurpinHero said:
> 
> 
> > Citezenship said:
> ...


This is how it worked for me!


----------



## Timeshifter (Jan 5, 2021)

Same, the set up recurring payment doesn't want to work, direct to paypal however is fine


----------



## Oracle (Jan 8, 2021)

I really , really hate putting my personal details on the net but I love this site and community and appreciate the admin team in rebuilding SH so bit the bullet and followed the link to state my donation which then sent me to paypal to open sn account.
I spent the next hour in having to repeat the application over and over(with great difficulty on mobile) and when I finally got to the last section uploading a document it froze stuck on loading.
I then tried to delete my personal details and close the account but the paypal site wouldn't let me do that either sending me on a loop of links over and over.
Paypal now has all my personal details, but I have no account and you have no donation.
Isn't it possible to donate by direct debit or card and if not are there any other solutions other than paypal that you may be considering?


----------



## JWW427 (Jan 9, 2021)

"Gold Patron"?
Whats next? Military ranks?
If so, Id like to be "Major Confusion."


----------



## dreamtime (Jan 9, 2021)

JWW427 said:


> "Gold Patron"?
> Whats next? Military ranks?
> If so, Id like to be "Major Confusion."



please tell me if you think this is overkill. i realized there’s no way to differentiate those who buy the 20$ upgrade compared to those who donate for example 3$. we can also change it back since most are probably just happy to support us and don’t expect special features back.

feedback is appreciated.

*update*: changed terms from "Gold Patron" to Patron, and "Patron" to "Supporter", and currently there's no difference in features between both, but this might change.


----------



## Myrrinda (Jan 9, 2021)

I have another e-mail address for PayPal, can you see that it was me donating when I click on it from here or how does that work?


----------



## dreamtime (Jan 9, 2021)

Myrrinda said:


> I have another e-mail address for PayPal, can you see that it was me donating when I click on it from here or how does that work?



Send me a private message when you donated and I will associate it with your account. But I think it should work, yes. Just log in with your paypal account. If it doesn't, just send money directly to our paypal e-mail.

*update*: it worked


----------



## Referent (Jan 12, 2021)

Oracle said:


> I really , really hate putting my personal details on the net...



Yeah, I would love to donate to the site slightly more anonymously too... not sure how many are in this boat.

The best solution I can think of would be to mail some cash somewhere in a security envelope between some sheets of paper.  Not perfect, but good enough for privacy/security maybe.  I notice some content creators set up post office boxes for this (could even be auto-forwarded, or through a "virtual mailbox" service, etc).  I know that this introduces its own management overhead, cost, concerns...

How to kickstart and test donate-by-mail, if found to be logistically agreeable?   I would pledge to donate the cost of one-years-worth of P.O. Box fees, via P.O. Box, once set up, if this is a good thing to try.  Then, if it doesn't stick, drop it in the future.

Maybe this is overthinking it.  Open to suggestions.


----------



## dreamtime (Jan 12, 2021)

Referent said:


> Oracle said:
> 
> 
> > I really , really hate putting my personal details on the net...
> ...



When you use liberapay you are completely anonymous to us. Only the service knows your payment details.

other than that you can always use bitcoin, although that can be a bit complicated if you are not into it. But with Bitcoin, depending on how you buy it, no one knows your identity.


----------



## dreamtime (Jan 12, 2021)

Oracle said:


> I really , really hate putting my personal details on the net but I love this site and community and appreciate the admin team in rebuilding SH so bit the bullet and followed the link to state my donation which then sent me to paypal to open sn account.
> I spent the next hour in having to repeat the application over and over(with great difficulty on mobile) and when I finally got to the last section uploading a document it froze stuck on loading.
> I then tried to delete my personal details and close the account but the paypal site wouldn't let me do that either sending me on a loop of links over and over.
> Paypal now has all my personal details, but I have no account and you have no donation.
> Isn't it possible to donate by direct debit or card and if not are there any other solutions other than paypal that you may be considering?



Paying with credit and debit card is possible when using liberapay.


----------



## Oracle (Jan 12, 2021)

dreamtime said:


> Oracle said:
> 
> 
> > I really , really hate putting my personal details on the net but I love this site and community and appreciate the admin team in rebuilding SH so bit the bullet and followed the link to state my donation which then sent me to paypal to open sn account.
> ...


But clicking on your Librepay link and typing in my donation amount was what sent me to paypal ?
It was an automatic redirect from there.
I will try again today.
I wonder is it because of my countries financial laws for international transactions. They are very strict since all the "terrorist" acts.

Update: I went back to Liberpay.
The only option it allows for me is paypal.I went to Paypal again and managed to complete my account registration. They say they will get back to me in 2 to 3 business days. Hopefully once they do the donation will go through. I think possibly it was my vpn going through another country that upset paypal.When I used an Australian server it processed no problems.


----------



## sole (Feb 14, 2021)

This forum is *controlled *and *censored*, so I find it highly unlikely it is not funded by the controllers.


----------



## dreamtime (Feb 14, 2021)

sole said:


> This forum is *controlled *and *censored*, so I find it highly unlikely it is not funded by the controllers.



You should have included that you are just salty at us because we didn't allow your thread "ALL World-Leaders and Super-Famous are 100% Fictional Characters" to be published, because there's no clear connection to history and your post only contained a list of people.


----------



## sole (Feb 14, 2021)

dreamtime said:


> sole said:
> 
> 
> > This forum is *controlled *and *censored*, so I find it highly unlikely it is not funded by the controllers.
> ...



"No clear connection to history" is poppycock. Not only did I mention characters such as George Washington, who is King George III, and Hitler, who is Walt Disney and a multitude of other fake characters. my post directly related to historical events and historical deception.

My post contained links to thousands of hours of reseeach.

You can argue this forum is not funded by the powers that be but no way can you say it is not *censored *and *controlled*!


----------



## dreamtime (Feb 14, 2021)

sole said:


> dreamtime said:
> 
> 
> > sole said:
> ...



You are free to post a thread about the topic if it includes more than a youtube link and a copied list of people, and if it adds a new perspective to history not yet found on the usual conspiracy-boards. Everyone here can click on the link. Post it in this thread if you don't want to add anything beyond it.

If we wanted to censor you we would simply delete all your posts and prevent you from writing anything in the forum. We just want to keep a certain standard here, which means for some wild claims we require more than simple speculation in the OP, otherwise the thread will devolve pretty quickly from there on.


----------



## 6079SmithW (Feb 14, 2021)

sole said:


> This forum is *controlled *and *censored*, so I find it highly unlikely it is not funded by the controllers.


I find this level of accusation infantile. 

I have spoken to the founders of SH.net via video link, and can attest that they are not funded by "the controllers".


----------



## sole (Feb 14, 2021)

You are a great censor and controller.


6079SmithW said:


> sole said:
> 
> 
> > This forum is *controlled *and *censored*, so I find it highly unlikely it is not funded by the controllers.
> ...



Great proof LOL!


----------



## 6079SmithW (Feb 14, 2021)

sole said:


> You are a great censor and controller.
> 
> 
> 6079SmithW said:
> ...


Sole,

We all want you to be a happy and contributing member of the forum. I know it's frustrating that your thread got blocked, this isn't to 'censor' you - it's because we are a select and dedicated group here - and we like to make sure that if we assert something, we have hard evidence to back it up. 

If we didn't do that, this site would be just like any number of 'conspiracy' forums - which you are welcome to join. 

I think you are here, because we are more advanced in our thinking and have a far more coherent view of the real conspiracy at work, and we can prove it by historical evidences. 

So quit with the accusations, and develop your thread with some more sources, and information. 

Cheers


----------



## Citezenship (Feb 14, 2021)

sole said:


> This forum is *controlled *and *censored*, so I find it highly unlikely it is not funded by the controllers.


Really? 
Please elaborate why you feel this way and point us in the direction of the proof that you have.

Thanks


----------



## luddite (Feb 15, 2021)

dreamtime said:


> sole said:
> 
> 
> > This forum is *controlled *and *censored*, so I find it highly unlikely it is not funded by the controllers.
> ...



The thread in question linked to a YT playlist by the YT user "House4SaleByOwner" which has the friendly name "sol". Potentially he was just trying to get more hits.

Controlled: We have mods and they try to quality control as much as possible in their spare time away from their family and work commitments.

Censored: Any thread or post that is removed is done so in a process of request via communication with the user in question. It is up to the user to modify in accordance with the request. In this instance you didn't bother.

Occasionally we get accused of being some gov agency psyop and my response is always the same. "I wish we were because then at least we would get paid well and we could quit our day jobs and moderate from a beach in the Bahamas."


----------

