# Photo of Empty Geneva



## aj00148 (Nov 13, 2020)

Wanted to share this picture I found in an attic at an antique store while I crate digging through vinyl records. I pinned it to my wall.

Was watching Jon Levy this afternoon and I remembered I have this. The streets are emptied and both the water and skyline appear doctored, especially the white mountain range on the left.

I can’t pinpoint the date this was made - other than that it feels very similar to Victorian era cabinet cards. The text at the bottom says “suisse et savoie” and “f. charnaux, geneve”.

Please share your thoughts, thanks again!


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## JWW427 (Nov 13, 2020)

The shadows suggest midday.
Everyone is inside having a hot chocolate and some fondue.
Mystery solved...


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## Citezenship (Nov 13, 2020)

Those pics look heavily doctored, like those old postcards with the colours turned right up!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/1144485771...84619895229426&abcId=2145997&merchantid=87779
Looks a bit different today, anyone know if it has had a revision, says it was built 1862


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## aj00148 (Nov 14, 2020)

I’d like to see if there’s an aerial view of this or an old map - I wonder what the aerial layout of the park on the right is because I wonder if it’s star shaped, but maybe that’s wishful thinking.


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## Citezenship (Nov 14, 2020)

aj00148 said:


> I’d like to see if there’s an aerial view of this or an old map - I wonder what the aerial layout of the park on the right is because I wonder if it’s star shaped, but maybe that’s wishful thinking.


Yes it is, or it used to be, now it has a statue of some famous philosopher!


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## anotherlayer (Nov 15, 2020)

Lotta poop on the road.


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## OfTheBrave (Nov 15, 2020)

Citezenship said:


> aj00148 said:
> 
> 
> > I’d like to see if there’s an aerial view of this or an old map - I wonder what the aerial layout of the park on the right is because I wonder if it’s star shaped, but maybe that’s wishful thinking.
> ...



It may be of note that in the last pic it says - "Post Tenebras Lux" which means "After Darkness Light" or "Light After Darkness"
According to wikipedia the phrase was adopted by protestants during the reformation in the 16th century.

Do with that what you will.


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## davtash (Nov 16, 2020)

superb thread deserves much more attention, What does mainstream say about this time? sends shivers down my spine, in fact the whole of that so called period in history does along with what is happening now


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## Citezenship (Nov 16, 2020)

davtash said:


> superb thread deserves much more attention, What does mainstream say about this time? sends shivers down my spine, in fact the whole of that so called period in history does along with what is happening now


Yes indeed it does, the photo's above a so dissimilar, the pics from the above photo/postcard are clearly a paste up!

I also notice that in the pics from the postcard/pics from above that the lake/sea level has changed, last 150 years the sea/lake level has seemed to have risen.

Also geneva has many many mudflood buildings, loads of half buried cellars!


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## codis (Nov 16, 2020)

Citezenship said:


> Those pics look heavily doctored, like those old postcards with the colours turned right up!


These are the chemicals used to develop the photos. They turn into that brownish color over time.

Anyway, the title is quite a stretch.
It is not an "empty Geneva", but just a few empty streets of Geneva.  Not every city is like New York or London, you can catch several streets empty at the right times.


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## Jd755 (Nov 16, 2020)

"After darkness light" could refer to the time the photograph was taken. Given its winter as the trees bear witness to, could it be a picture taken after the winter solstice. Do the Swiss celebrate such an event either today or back then?
Water holding capacity of lakes is in flux as they are a part of a dynamic system.


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## JWW427 (Nov 16, 2020)

If we all look closely at Citizenship's Geneva star city map, consider the huge amount of farmland around it to support the populace.
In war, the enemy could starve the city out in a couple of months by capturing that farmland and sitting tight. Why didn't they fortify some of the farmland?
Once again, not a good idea to split fortifications via river, and the riverside is not fortified. Sorry to go off topic, but its significant.
Theres nothing better than spending millions of gold francs to fortify those formal gardens!
Also, theres obviously nothing easier than building a redoubt in the middle of the river. Maybe thats where everyone was in the vacant street photo.


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## grav (Nov 16, 2020)

Flat Earth British has done a video or two about empty cities.
Possibly a camera processing issue? as people used to have to sit perfectly still for old photography methods that could not capture a moving object.


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## codis (Nov 16, 2020)

grav said:


> Flat Earth British has done a video or two about empty cities.
> Possibly a camera processing issue? as people used to have to sit perfectly still for old photography methods that could not capture a moving object.


No.
Their image would be "dragged" over the the part of the image they move during the exposure.
Which looks very much like ghosts in recent movies.
You can see them on some of those old images, but most of them were discarded by the photographer, who regarded them as spoiled.


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## Jd755 (Nov 16, 2020)

The mid river land could simply be gravel beaches or possibly rocky outcrops or man made islands built by dumping rock on the riverbed or could even be the remnants of a once intact rocky wall that was either deliberately removed or destroyed by natural processes say earthquake for example or and this one might make one laugh but it could be the remains of a beaver dam that trapped silt and rocks which backed up to create the island(s) and all man did was add to them, there doesn't seem to be any way to establish anything about their origin.
Is it truly the same town on the maps and engraving as the extent of the wall constructions varies a lot and the bridge in the engraving reminds me of the London Bridge which is depicted having houses and other buildings on its length and if I am recalling correctly another built up bridge used to cross the Seine in Paris.
In any case no ships could pass from lake to river.
Does the modern bridge tally with the position of any of the bridges on the maps and engraving?


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## Citezenship (Nov 16, 2020)

kd-755 said:


> The mid river land could simply be gravel beaches or possibly rocky outcrops or man made islands built by dumping rock on the riverbed or could even be the remnants of a once intact rocky wall that was either deliberately removed or destroyed by natural processes say earthquake for example or and this one might make one laugh but it could be the remains of a beaver dam that trapped silt and rocks which backed up to create the island(s) and all man did was add to them, there doesn't seem to be any way to establish anything about their origin.
> Is it truly the same town on the maps and engraving as the extent of the wall constructions varies a lot and the bridge in the engraving reminds me of the London Bridge which is depicted having houses and other buildings on its length and if I am recalling correctly another built up bridge used to cross the Seine in Paris.
> In any case no ships could pass from lake to river.
> Does the modern bridge tally with the position of any of the bridges on the maps and engraving?


I also have doubts about the engraving, i am guessing that it is from a much earlier period as the outer walls of the star are three fold, also the engraving is wildly out of proportion(the walls are huge, towering over 2-3 story houses) but again this might be because of it's age and artistic techniques that were, were not, available.

The mountainous background is also quite suspect but again may just be artistic license!

Again those walls look really big and they are not there anymore,



 

Not the best image overlay as the drawing is not that accurate but you get the idea, the only things left are the islands.



This is such a good feature of google earth and can really highlight how our modern city's are still layed out on these old world designs!


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## Bogdan (Nov 16, 2020)

Really nice pic OP. Wish you could do a scan to examine a bit in higher quality. Do you have any idea what date this could be? If I had to guess, I would put it between 1860-1920. I personally don't think it's empty, because you can "clearly" see movement on the bridge. Seems like the photo's exposure time was something between 5-10s. There are ghosts on the bridge but also in the background. That's why the outter branches of these trees are smudgy (not too much wind though), and the water looks like ice. Very nice find nevertheless, would pin that to my wall too!


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## Jd755 (Nov 16, 2020)

Some more photos with dates.
1850 Source



1880 Source


​1908 Source



1910 Source


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## Bogdan (Nov 16, 2020)

Here some pics from the Burgerbibliothek Bern (Burgergemeinde/Bourgeoisies). They don't have better quality in their online catalogue:




until 1877 they say




between 1863 - 1865




1734




1680-1731




after 1602




after 1602




1603




1800s they say




1800s they say




1800s they say




1800s they say

below ones 1824-1839:


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## Citezenship (Nov 16, 2020)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Geneva
I know it is just the wiki but it is an interesting snapshot of the history of Geneva, i had no idea it was such a tumultuous place, wars, famine, tsunami's....


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## Samson4prez (Nov 17, 2020)

aj00148 said:


> View attachment 2700
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> ...


Definitely heavily edited... photo tampering and editing is just as old if not older than photography


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