# Was Jesus Christ Julius Caesar?



## Apollonius (Aug 28, 2021)

Julius Caesar (Iulius Caesar):




 




 




 


Jesus Christ (Iesus Christ):



 




 





These two people, who are physically similar, also show a lot of similarity in terms of story.

Jesus Christ:

He started his career in Galilee.
He crossed the Jordan river.
His rival was Herod.
He had an relationship with Magdalena.
Judas betrayed him.
Accused of declaring himself king of the Jews.
He was born by the star of Bethlehem.
He was stabbed to death on the cross.

Julius Caesar:

He started his career in Gaul.
He crossed the Rubicon river.
His rival was Pompey.
He had an relationship with Cleopatra.
Brutus betrayed him.
Accused of declaring himself king of the Romans.
He was declared a saint by the star of Caesar.
He was stabbed to death on his throne.
The Shroud of Turin may also belong to the body of Julius Caesar because both of them were killed by being injured in almost the same places.

Turin of Shroud:


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## dreamtime (Aug 28, 2021)

Either one of the two was a template used for the other, or both were copied from another original. I fail to see how original Christianity could have developed around a faked copy of Caesar, so I think the Christ figure is the one real, and the Caesar figure copied. But I also think that the known biography of Jesus is a fake - the original Christ figure got replaced by the Fake hebrew Jesus we now know from the Bible.

This may only be partially related, but here's what some say is an authentic "photo of Jesus":




​​_In the early 1990's I visited Maurice Finkel, the editor of Australasian Health and Healing (no longer in print). He demonstrated to me with his pendulum the extraordinary radiation across the room from a photo he had just published in his journal. He had received the photo from tourists who had taken pictures in Israel. On one of these photos were several figures that were not seen when it was taken. It was obviously a scene at the shores of Lake Galilee (also called the Sea of Galilee) where Jesus used to teach._​
​​_From the New Testament it is obvious to me that this scene shows Jesus talking to Nicodemus as in John 3:1-21. I beleive that the third figure was James the Just, the younger brother of Jesus. The present digital photo still appears to radiate the same powerful energy as the original analogue photo._​

Source: Health-Science-Spirit - Photo of Jesus

Also there's a very long and interesting thread on this topic on another forum: Was Julius Caesar the real Jesus Christ?


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## Silveryou (Aug 28, 2021)

Here a must read about it: Francesco Carotta - Homepage



Apollonius said:


> He crossed the Jordan river.





Apollonius said:


> He crossed the Rubicon river.


See Joshua's tale. 'At the Jordan River, the waters parted, as they had for Moses at the Red Sea' (Joshua - Wikipedia). He was in any case present at the crossing of the Red Sea with Moses. The Latin word _Rubico_ comes from the adjective _rubeus_, meaning "red" (Rubicon - Wikipedia).


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## Apollonius (Aug 28, 2021)

dreamtime said:


> Either one of the two was a template used for the other, or both were copied from another original. I fail to see how original Christianity could have developed around a faked copy of Caesar, so I think the Christ figure is the one real, and the Caesar figure copied. But I also think that the known biography of Jesus is a fake - the original Christ figure got replaced by the Fake hebrew Jesus we now know from the Bible.
> 
> This may only be partially related, but here's what some say is an authentic "photo of Jesus":
> 
> ...


The people will always choose the _*good*_ copy, especially the one chosen by *God*. There isn't a person who turns the other cheek with a slap on the cheek. All these *good-hearted*, *honest heroes* were convinced to put the people to sleep and disconnect them from reality.

Therefore, if there is a real person, it isn't Jesus Christ; but Julius Caesar.

Of course, these are my opinions, I have no problems with religions or religious people. I have the utmost respect for all of your beliefs and opinions.


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## dreamtime (Aug 28, 2021)

Apollonius said:


> Therefore, if there is a real person, it isn't Jesus Christ; but Julius Caesar.



I think a better question is: who was the original human or being that served as a template. for example it's possible that they split it up into a "religious persona" and a "political persona", and both are fake in the sense that they aren't complete. That would explain why there is no mention of jesus in the official history sources, but there are lots of sources mentioning caesar.

The enormous energy that radiates and echoes throughout the ages is evidence for me that there is something real behind the Jesus persona.

So Jesus Christ and Caesar were the same, but what were they?

Or maybe The Roman Catholic Church stole the identify of the original Jesus Christ and created a copy of Caesar to create a religious cult?


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## Daniel (Aug 28, 2021)

According to Fomenko, it's Andronicus I of Byzantium.
TSAR OF THE SLAVS


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## EUAFU (Aug 28, 2021)

Jesus was one character and Caesar another.

Such "coincidences", in quotation marks, as they do not take into account important details such as the supposed "relationship" between Jesus and Mary Magdalene, is more the result of the desire of Gnostic and anti-Catholic sects than a reality and has nothing in common with the relationship of Cleopatra and Caesar.

And showing a picture of the Holy Shroud and saying that there is a relationship between the alleged stab wounds Caesar received and Jesus' wounds is an extrapolation that doesn't even make sense; unless you know where Caesar took his blows.

As for the iconography shown to establish the physical resemblance between Jesus and Caesar, it is another one that is meaningless, since it is known that in the Middle Ages European artists characterized all historical characters as if they lived in the period in which the artist produced his works; from clothes to physical appearance would be an emulation of the artist's region.

Where are the 12 apostles of Caesar? And your miracles? Where is John the Baptist of Caesar?

That's my opinion at the moment.


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## Silveryou (Aug 28, 2021)

EUAFU said:


> Jesus was one character and Caesar another.
> 
> Such "coincidences", in quotation marks, as they do not take into account important details such as the supposed "relationship" between Jesus and Mary Magdalene, is more the result of the desire of Gnostic and anti-Catholic sects than a reality and has nothing in common with the relationship of Cleopatra and Caesar.
> 
> ...


I think it's difficult to outright say that "yes, Jesus _is _Caesar_"_, but the similarities are abundant, whether they should be ascribed to Middle ages Europeans' ignorance or rather to some real tales who have slowly but surely been deemed myths giving rise to our modern dogma of these two being two different characters as the history book tells us. In the link I posted you can find many of these similarities. Here some of them given by Carotta (Jesus was Caesar - Summary):



> C) PEOPLE IN THE STORIES OF CAESAR AND OF JESUS ARE STRUCTURALLY THE SAME PEOPLE, EVEN BY NAME AND LOCATION:
> Caesar > Jesus
> Pompey > John (the Baptist)
> Antonius > Simon
> ...


I want to add that Pompey's head iconography is identical to that of John the Baptist.





Another author who has found many interesting parallels is Joseph Atwill in his Caesar's Messiah (Full text of "Caesar's Messiah [The Roman Conspiracy To Invent Jesus].pdf (PDFy mirror)"). He also compares Jesus to Caesar with an analysis of the Gospels, but the Caesar he refers to is Titus...

EDIT:


> the conspirator (Cassius) _Longinus,_ becoming the centurion _Longinus_ stabbing Jesus on the cross


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## Daniel (Aug 28, 2021)

I think we need to consider the possibility that the reason all the highly educated Artists of the time depicted those people as wearing Mediaeval or "Renaissance" clothes is because the people they were depicting lived in Mediaeval or "Renaissance" times.

It is ONLY because we hold the fundamental structure of the BC/AD Chonology to be sound, that we would even conceive of the idea that the likes of Leonardo Da Vinci, Albrecht Durer, Botticelli, etc. etc. "have to" have painted "anachronistic" depictions of famous figures. What if they were all right, and it is the modern understanding of the way these people looked and dressed that is mistaken?


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## Silveryou (Aug 28, 2021)

Daniel said:


> I think we need to consider the possibility that the reason all the highly educated Artists of the time depicted those people as wearing Mediaeval or "Renaissance" clothes is because the people they were depicting lived in Mediaeval or "Renaissance" times.


I agree. But I think there is more to it. Take these Renaissance paintings by the 'Byzantine' Nikolaos Tzafouris and the Italian Giorgio Vasari. They both represent a distinct kind of soldier with some peculiar armors and weapons. The one by Tzafouris (the second here below) supposedly represents ancient Romans during Christ's cruxifiction 1500 years before his time, even though critics recognize the typical medieval Byzantine armor, while the one by Vasari (the first below) represents the Catholic faction during Saint Bartholomew's Day massacre happening in his own time. They for sure look very similar, if not identical. And then Tzafouris was so stupid or ignorant to represent another kind of Roman bearing an SPQR flag and wearing a western suit of armor. This shows how different clothes and armors/weapons coexisted and were arbitrarily separated by the incorrect chronology, imo.


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## Apollonius (Aug 28, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> I agree. But I think there is more to it. Take these Renaissance paintings by the 'Byzantine' Nikolaos Tzafouris and the Italian Giorgio Vasari. They both represent a distinct kind of soldier with some peculiar armors and weapons. The one by Tzafouris supposedly represents ancient Romans during Christ's cruxifiction 1500 years before his time, even though critics recognize the typical medieval Byzantine armor, while the one by Vasari represents the Catholic faction during Saint Bartholomew's Day massacre happening in his own time. They for sure look very similar, if not identical. And then Tzafouris was so stupid or ignorant to represent another kind of Roman bearing an SPQR flag and wearing a western suit of armor. This shows how different clothes and armors/weapons coexisted and were arbitrarily separated by the incorrect chronology, imo.
> View attachment 12396View attachment 12397
> View attachment 12398View attachment 12399
> View attachment 12400​


Also, there is no absurd difference like 1000 years between years.

I think we are in the year *i.1021*, not in 2021. TPTB added 1000 years to the chronology to add fake figures to history and manipulate history thoroughly.


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## huskofahuman (Aug 28, 2021)

I feel he was real, as the need and urge of the global elites to destroy Christianity and erase it from history.  

I'm not a Christian mind you, but I have eyes that see.  Islam and Judaism are just fine with the elites as are all the other religions, I only see Christianity being lambasted over and over again.  Churches were destroyed to be replaced by Mosques, black cube worship in Judaism and Islam, etc.


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## Apollonius (Aug 29, 2021)

huskofahuman said:


> I feel he was real, as the need and urge of the global elites to destroy Christianity and erase it from history.
> 
> I'm not a Christian mind you, but I have eyes that see.  Islam and Judaism are just fine with the elites as are all the other religions, I only see Christianity being lambasted over and over again.  Churches were destroyed to be replaced by Mosques, black cube worship in Judaism and Islam, etc.


Churches or mosques, none of which were used for *worship purposes* at the time.

Religions are what the 1% produce to *rule* the other 99%.


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## ThreeEyedRaven (Aug 29, 2021)

I honestly feel that Jesus represents benevolence in the new testament. Jupiter and Zeus were the same sorts of heroic figures and if you combine them both you get Jesus. JupiterZeus. Jesus. If you look into the bible and take the actions of God in the old testament, it is a God of wrath. I believe this would relate more to the Saturn/Cronos figure in the story. This leads one to the revelation that religions are retelling the same stories for different cultures. Santos Bonacci does a good job of describing religion as a language for each culture describing the same message overall. Over the years these stories have been warped and twisted to obfuscate the message. (Sounds familiar to our history.)

There has been a lot of research that has begun to come to light on the way that every major religion seems to be a telling of the same events in our sky. I would recommend looking into the rabbit hole of astrotheology. Many events in every religious text can be related to correlating processions of our stars above. David Mathisen has written some good books on the matter and his website, Star Myth World is a source of many great examples of these stories across a multitude of religions.

So, in conclusion, I'd say Jesus is much closer to Jupiter than he would be Caesar. I would be inclined to think that Caesar was a real character in history, but Jesus is more of a metaphor for benevolence.



huskofahuman said:


> I'm not a Christian mind you, but I have eyes that see. Islam and Judaism are just fine with the elites as are all the other religions, I only see Christianity being lambasted over and over again. Churches were destroyed to be replaced by Mosques, black cube worship in Judaism and Islam, etc.



Would it be of your belief that religion has been cast aside by society as of late? Do you think that there has been an agenda to take god or religion from man? That makes me wonder if you have seen Christianity take the brunt of this because in America that is the main source of religion. (Assuming you are in America and not using a VPN for your flag.)

I believe that culturally all religion has been given a label of silly. I believe science is being ushered in to replace religion lately. "Trust the science we are all just specs of meaninglessness."


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## Silveryou (Aug 29, 2021)

ThreeEyedRaven said:


> I believe that culturally all religion has been given a label of silly. I believe science is being ushered in to replace religion lately. "Trust the science we are all just specs of meaninglessness."


This was done by Christianity to the previous 'pagan' beliefs too: "Trust Christianity we are all just specs of meaninglessness". And this is why there are people who want to look into the historical character called Jesus who walked on this earth and had nothing to do with stars. I also believe there is an astral component in 'myth' and know Mathisen work and some other authors too, but this is not the subject brought up by Apollonius, imo. I don't know if there is a specific thread for this though, maybe you can open one!


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## ThreeEyedRaven (Aug 29, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> This was done by Christianity to the previous 'pagan' beliefs too: "Trust Christianity we are all just specs of meaninglessness". And this is why there are people who want to look into the historical character called Jesus who walked on this earth and had nothing to do with stars. I also believe there is an astral component in 'myth' and know Mathisen work and some other authors too, but this is not the subject brought up by Apollonius, imo. I don't know if there is a specific thread for this though, maybe you can open one!


I do agree that it was done to Christianity as well as all major religions of the world. I believe they continue to rewrite and change the Bible over and over to further obfuscate. 

I may have been unclear, but it is of my belief that Jesus is more of a parabolic character and not an actual historical figure. I don't believe that Caesar and Jesus were the same person because I do believe Jesus was more of a metaphor for benevolence. I would be inclined to think that the similarities stem from propping up Caesar to be a hero character as well. 

The last bit in my above post was not meant to derail the topic but look at it from another point of view. 

I do think you are right if there isn't a thread for this, it would make an excellent discussion. I would have to ponder more on how to go about approaching the subject.


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## EUAFU (Aug 29, 2021)

"On earth as in heaven".

Everything that happens on Earth also happens in heaven. And I'm not referring to heaven as paradise, but rather what we observe at night.

The birth of Jesus was predicted astrologically by someone who could read the stars. What he did on Earth also has an astral counterpart.

In fact, this is true for each of us. Therefore, it is quite logical that scholars find correspondence between the life of Jesus and, in fact, any character, with the astral movements.

Furthermore, Jesus' actions and words are physical teachings for those who witnessed them at the time, mythological so that the message will not be distorted over time, and profound spiritual teachings for those who can read through mythology.

If people had time to study astrology/astornomy they would inevitably discover that "dramatic" events that took place in their lives had astral counterparts taking place in the same period.

I believe Jesus existed and Caesar did too.


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## Oracle (Aug 29, 2021)

I would have to go with the neither existed ( sorry I dislike polls so I haven't clicked your button ).
 I currently believe both historical characters were invented as part of the creation of a religious and imperial fake past that has led to our current World.
A deliberate scheme by those who destroyed a previous world of peace and collaboration that is represented figuratively by a Christ persona.

To me the Roman Empire as described to us is nothing more than the taking over of a former civilization following catastrophe,by entities that quite possibly are not even human as we know it and stay hidden in the background through their use of unevolved human traitors and tyrants as puppet leaders.

Christianity as with other religions ( and yes I include paganism here) was created to divide and conquer in a similar manner by the same entities to control and to further destroy living memory of a former state of united,peaceful and happy existance.Slaves are happy with their lot if they know no other, as our descendants are being trained for now.

I don't think anyone here will argue with the fact chronology is not as we have been told and the thousand year addition seems a fair estimate.

A lot of the symbolism and characters of religion and myth are completely related to cosmic events,cataclysm, and believe it or not alchemy and magic but your subject title is quite clear and direct so I also, as others above shall leave it at that.

Edited: for clarity and formating.


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## Shabda Preceptor (Aug 29, 2021)

It has long been wondered and debated whether or not Ioesus, Saint Issa, and Appolonius of Tyana were the same individual being that all lived in the first century and that no one is actually certain of the identity of any of these individuals and that all were claimed to have had mystical or magical abilities, where much appears to be interchangeable between any of them. Obviously there would have been religious differences between them (between the Greeks and the Jews) but none of that necessarily proves them not the same or without some connection other than having apparently walked the earth during the same period.

I had never heard of the idea of Jesus and Ceasar being the same person before today, but what I have heard (from Joseph Atwill in 2013) is the idea that Jesus was a Roman Empire created psy-op based on the fact that the Mosiach in Hebrew legend and prophecy was to be a warrior that would conquer the Roman Empire and free Judea. Suddenly here comes Jesus preaching about "turn the other cheek." Quite the opposite of a warrior who would lead the people to be rid of the empire's control, thus the reasoning for it to have ever been a purposeful idea carried out by the Romans. Atwill claims that the Flavian Dynasty was behind this and not the Julio-Claudian Dynasty, at least in part because one of the Flavians, Titus, son of the newest Emperor had gone to Judea to put down the revolts there supposedly becoming a literal "fisher of men" so to speak after having sunk their entire fishing fleet. Of course there is also the fact that the Roman Senate literally made it law that Ceasar was divine, or Divi Filius, "the Son Of God" 2 years after Julius was assassinated thus making way for that term to have been used also by Roman emperors just as it has been for Christ, whomever he is or was (If).

So, basically nothing definite is provided about any of these individuals, and only more elements added into the pot of whom one or all of them might have been. I used years from historical reports despite that any of them may well not be actually accurate, just as a way of referencing the potentially possible relationships between each idea. I also have no involvement (for or against) with any of the religions or religious ideas mentioned.


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## EUAFU (Aug 29, 2021)

Shabda Preceptor said:


> It has long been wondered and debated whether or not Ioesus, Saint Issa, and Appolonius of Tyana were the same individual being that all lived in the first century and that no one is actually certain of the identity of any of these individuals and that all were claimed to have had mystical or magical abilities, where much appears to be interchangeable between any of them. Obviously there would have been religious differences between them (between the Greeks and the Jews) but none of that necessarily proves them not the same or without some connection other than having apparently walked the earth during the same period.
> 
> I had never heard of the idea of Jesus and Ceasar being the same person before today, but what I have heard (from Joseph Atwill in 2013) is the idea that Jesus was a Roman Empire created psy-op based on the fact that the Mosiach in Hebrew legend and prophecy was to be a warrior that would conquer the Roman Empire and free Judea. Suddenly here comes Jesus preaching about "turn the other cheek." Quite the opposite of a warrior who would lead the people to be rid of the empire's control, thus the reasoning for it to have ever been a purposeful idea carried out by the Romans. Atwill claims that the Flavian Dynasty was behind this and not the Julio-Claudian Dynasty, at least in part because one of the Flavians had gone to Judea to put down the revolts there supposedly becoming a literal "fisher of men" so to speak by throwing spears with ropes tied to them through the bodies of Hebrews in the revolt. Of course there is also the fact that the Roman Senate literally made it law that Ceasar was divine, or Divi Filius, "the Son Of God" 2 years after Julius was assassinated thus making way for that term to have been used also by Roman emperors just as it has been for Christ, whomever he is or was (If).
> 
> So, basically nothing definite is provided about any of these individuals, and only more elements added into the pot of whom one or all of them might have been. I used years from historical reports despite that any of them may well not be actually accurate, just as a way of referencing the potentially possible relationships between each idea. I also have no involvement (for or against) with any of the religions or religious ideas mentioned.


Rome ruled a vast empire for what special reason would they create a lie to appease a people, lost in the middle of the desert, that they could slaughter and disperse (as they did) easily?


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## Silveryou (Aug 29, 2021)

I think Atwill's research should be distinguished from Atwill's opinions. The parallelism he found is more important than his explanations, imo


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## Shabda Preceptor (Aug 29, 2021)

EUAFU said:


> Rome ruled a vast empire for what special reason would they create a lie to appease a people, lost in the middle of the desert, that they could slaughter and disperse (as they did) easily?


Quite easy to answer really. If one supposes it to have been a psychological operation in the first place, the reason for doing it is population control. Not of number of people as is so often mentioned presently, but in the way of making of the Jews a more peaceful and willing tax base. That is from Atwill's theory and his book, which I haven't read but the idea seems easy enough to understand and I find it believable, though no one can really say what the fact of the matter was. When an empire has a frequently revolting people who are heavily taxed, why not subjugate their religious views to quell the rioting? Among the Jews, the Messianic movement was what (according to Atwill) drove them to revolt.


_View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmEScIUcvz0&feature=emb_rel_end_


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## Silveryou (Aug 29, 2021)

Shabda Preceptor said:


> Quite easy to answer really. If one supposes it to have been a psychological operation in the first place, the reason for doing it is population control. Not of number of people as is so often mentioned presently, but in the way of making of the Jews a more peaceful and willing tax base. That is from Atwill's theory and his book, which I haven't read but the idea seems easy enough to understand and I find it believable, though no one can really say what the fact of the matter was. When an empire has a frequently revolting people who are heavily taxed, why not subjugate their religious views to quell the rioting? Among the Jews, the Messianic movement was what (according to Atwill) drove them to revolt.
> 
> 
> _View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmEScIUcvz0&feature=emb_rel_end_



You can read it at the link I provided above.

In any case the opposite can be said as well. The Jews prompted their religion by distorting the real person of an Emperor thus creating Christianity as a mean to conquer the Empire from the inside.


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## EUAFU (Aug 29, 2021)

Shabda Preceptor said:


> Quite easy to answer really. If one supposes it to have been a psychological operation in the first place, the reason for doing it is population control. Not of number of people as is so often mentioned presently, but in the way of making of the Jews a more peaceful and willing tax base. That is from Atwill's theory and his book, which I haven't read but the idea seems easy enough to understand and I find it believable, though no one can really say what the fact of the matter was. When an empire has a frequently revolting people who are heavily taxed, why not subjugate their religious views to quell the rioting? Among the Jews, the Messianic movement was what (according to Atwill) drove them to revolt.
> 
> 
> _View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmEScIUcvz0&feature=emb_rel_end_



It's unlikely. It seems more like a thesis for selling books than anything else.

If Palestine were a big country with a huge population it would make sense...if they were successful in promoting Jesus, which did not happen among the Jews.

Also I doubt they had that perspective of PSYOP, Rome let every people have their beliefs what interested them was the money flowing.


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## Shabda Preceptor (Aug 29, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> You can read it at the link I provided above.
> 
> In any case the opposite can be said as well. The Jews prompted their religion by distorting the real person of an Emperor thus creating Christianity as a mean to conquer the Empire from the inside.


Oh sure, that is always the case and with nearly everything. That is why so many speak of duality, myself included. There is ALWAYS an opposite POV and some who subscribe to it and are willing to debate or even argue against the opposing view. The same with every religion and every form of politics and social construct. It seems to me (and this is only opinion) that dealing with this difference is the primary source of most conflict that humans have, or lies at the heart of it. Should humanity ever figure out how to sort that out between all sides, we might even become more peaceful. Maybe.


EUAFU said:


> It's unlikely. It seems more like a thesis for selling books than anything else.
> 
> If Palestine were a big country with a huge population it would make sense...if they were successful in promoting Jesus, which did not happen among the Jews.
> 
> Also I doubt they had that perspective of PSYOP, Rome let every people have their beliefs what interested them was the money flowing.


On the other hand, the idea is hardly a modern one. People learned how to play mind games a very long time ago. It didn't begin recently. The Romans did it just as the Greeks, Persians, Africans and Indians did, and always have. You might not have noticed but it is stated that the Romans had Jews among them, so called banking families that had influence, so that also played a role in the idea because without their involvement, the idea could never have been possible. I still find it easily believable, but you are welcomed to accept any interpretation on it that you choose. Edited to say that I forgot to mention about his trying to sell his book, that I'd assume that a guaranteed fact because he'd not be very smart if he didn't try to lol.


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## Apollonius (Aug 29, 2021)

Shabda Preceptor said:


> Quite easy to answer really. If one supposes it to have been a psychological operation in the first place, the reason for doing it is population control. Not of number of people as is so often mentioned presently, but in the way of making of the Jews a more peaceful and willing tax base. That is from Atwill's theory and his book, which I haven't read but the idea seems easy enough to understand and I find it believable, though no one can really say what the fact of the matter was. When an empire has a frequently revolting people who are heavily taxed, why not subjugate their religious views to quell the rioting? Among the Jews, the Messianic movement was what (according to Atwill) drove them to revolt.
> 
> 
> _View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmEScIUcvz0&feature=emb_rel_end_



They invented a character called Jesus Christ for *mind control*, not population control.

If the people adopt a character that turns the other cheek after being slapped on the right cheek, the *obedient people* you see today will emerge.

Today they still commemorate *the king* for these reasons alone.






All they care about is *power*. There is nothing sacred or mysterious, *nothing*.


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## Akanah (Aug 31, 2021)

There are similarities between Jesus and Caesar.
Some historians have even pointed out that the same "person" appeared several times in different countries and cultures as dictator or savior. 
When I once saw an old picture of Jesus, I noticed that the eyes of Jesus were unusually large so that I even had to think of a parallel to the alien face. My guess is that many people had seen someone powerful and could not properly classify this being. And so they made many different characters out of it depending on whether this being had harmed them or had brought beautiful miracles.
Through my thread "Embryonic-Earth" I tend to say that people saw the face of the earth (as an embryo) big in the sky and were surprised or frightened. This could then have come the many stories of dictators or saviors.
So behind both figures (Jesus and cäsar) there would be something real that has been fragmented in its representation.


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## Shabda Preceptor (Aug 31, 2021)

Apollonius said:


> They invented a character called Jesus Christ for *mind control*, not population control.
> 
> If the people adopt a character that turns the other cheek after being slapped on the right cheek, the *obedient people* you see today will emerge.
> 
> ...


How are mind or population control NOT the very same thing? They are exactly the same thing. And both of those equate to another thing you've mentioned. Power/control. Always the goal.

As for "There is nothing sacred or mysterious, *nothing*." I have to say that that is opinion, and one that you are unable to prove. Not that you aren't welcomed to have that opinion, but it would be more accurate to have added "as far as I know or have ever seen or experienced."

But those too are things not provable. That doesn't make them true or false, only an assertion. If I have seen or experienced something sacred AND mysterious, nothing anyone says could change that or make it not exist. But it also cannot be proven by me to you or any other. That is just the way of subjectivity. However the subjective experience often has other subjective experiences had by others, that can potentially verify it. Despite any of those, there will also always be those who claim all of them to be nothing more than imagination or delusion, yet no individual can ever actually prove any of these assertions to any other. Subjectivity again. It is a limiting factor within the physical world.

Also there is that claiming that nothing mysterious exists is rather prideful. One can have that opinion, but the opinion can just as easily wrap itself around you and bite you on your posterior. Life does exactly that and often, whether by the will of anyone or thing, or just by the fact that the potential for it to occur always exists and its happening being completely random. In both cases, it still happens to many.

In my own opinion, there is no guarantee that anyone can ever know everything. If that is the case, then that leaves a considerable amount that is prideful, and potentially might also be considered sacred. That is an individual's perception and state of being. That doesn't necessarily mean that every individual who considers a thing to be sacred necessarily does that by choice either. The same can happen entirely not by choice, or at the very least a conscious awareness that a choice extends out to include such a result, and one never is aware of that their first time experiencing it. Afterward they may or may not come to an awareness of that. Quite a LOT of gray area within everything. I've yet to meet the individual that actually knows everything, but if I ever do, I'll have a long list of questions.

Edited to point out that none of what I said here necessarily has anything to do with Jesus Christ or Caesar, although they easily could as well.


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## Silveryou (Aug 31, 2021)

Shabda Preceptor said:


> In my own opinion, there is no guarantee that anyone can ever know everything. If that is the case, then that leaves a considerable amount that is prideful, and potentially might also be considered sacred. That is an individual's perception and state of being. That doesn't necessarily mean that every individual who considers a thing to be sacred necessarily does that by choice either. The same can happen entirely not by choice, or at the very least a conscious awareness that a choice extends out to include such a result, and one never is aware of that their first time experiencing it. Afterward they may or may not come to an awareness of that. Quite a LOT of gray area within everything. I've yet to meet the individual that actually knows everything, but if I ever do, I'll have a long list of questions.


Everything you write is very beautiful. I have seen the background of your account, hinting at a world religion comprising all the various beliefs around the world today and your avatar reminds me of the 'lihgtbringer', Lucifer. I think this is a conscious choice, am I right? So my question to you is this: how can you claim that God (or whatever you want to call him/her/it) is the sum of those various beliefs, when you actually state that no one can know everything? I bet Albert Pike and other Freemasons who desperately wanted a NWO with a singular universal New Church thought they knew everything better than anyone else. Schwab, Gates (Melinda too) and others are their legitimate successors, obviously.


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## Shabda Preceptor (Aug 31, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> Everything you write is very beautiful. I have seen the background of your account, hinting at a world religion comprising all the various beliefs around the world today and your avatar reminds me of the 'lihgtbringer', Lucifer. I think this is a conscious choice, am I right? So my question to you is this: how can you claim that God (or whatever you want to call him/her/it) is the sum of those various beliefs, when you actually state that no one can know everything? I bet Albert Pike and other Freemasons who desperately wanted a NWO with a singular universal New Church thought they knew everything better than anyone else. Schwab, Gates (Melinda too) and others are their legitimate successors, obviously.


I don't purposely use my avatar for light bringer or even Lucifer , it is just because I like the sun as it is a light, and it is easily seen against a sky blue background which is my preferred color. I am aware of many of the beliefs and opinions concerning Lucifer, but I use none and agree with none personally. That is just my own POV and choice though I understand that many may have a differing view themselves. It is just a thing I see daily (the sun and blue sky) and have no particular problem with, nor place any particular significance to other than my own preference for the color.

I also make no claim to God, or that which is referred to by so many is the sum of anything. Each can and might differ in regard to the idea of the Godhead, and I have come across many, whether by way of any particular religion (and I have looked into most, if not all and have an awareness of them, but cannot claim to know or understand all of them in any way other than the way that I personally do) but can only use my own experience, and I have one. I have looked upon IT though I can claim no high state or status from that experience, nor that it is necessarily relevant to anyone in any way, only that that one experience definitely has much to do with how I interpret most things. I am aware that many have had some similar experience that they try to relate to others, and most religions have come to exist from others attempt to do that, although any religious or spiritual path that might come to be from that does not necessarily express whatever that original POV might have been for the individual who acted as the progenitor of each religion.

I have no willingness to join in any world church or religion either. I am certainly aware of the NWO's desire to have one and to use it for their purposes but I will never willingly be a part of that either as I consider it a control scheme. I'd rather reserve the right to follow my own, without a need for any to agree or follow that themselves. I have always been a strong believer in the phrase, " To each their own." I don't claim that the Godhead is the sum of anything, but rather the true progenitor of all that is. Now I've overused that word and will need to find another to use in its place. I claim that no one can know everything because to me that seems an obvious truth, plus I've yet to find any evidence to the contrary, although some may claim that contrary to exist from time to time.

To speak of God specifically, the only claim I can make is that I have directly witnessed IT, and knew what I was seeing without need for confirming that in any way. I can make no particular claim about IT, other than that I don't necessarily agree with the various interpretations or descriptions offered. I find IT to be a thing that seems to refuse to be so encapsulated. Perhaps that is why so many throughout the ages have sought to use poetry as a way of expressing things about "IT." A way of relating that Limitlessness that can be perceived as opposed to everything else that exists within the world that our senses can be aware of. I'm not sure if I am making any degree of sense at all, but it is something of a paradox, trying to use words, a limited product of the mind, which is also limited, to describe a thing completely outside of both. I am probably failing as much as all religions do inevitably. That is the quality IMO that eventually makes them a tool to be used tor control.  I doubt that any start out as a means of control, but regardless of how good they might be at relating the experiences of one, and even of relating a method to enable others to also have experiences, the dual nature of the world makes that usefulness temporary at best. It cannot remain that way because it must eventually fall to an equal depth to the height it once possessed or enabled humans to attain. An endless cycle.

This is starting to sound too much to me like preaching or ranting, so I'll bring it to an end before anyone gets the idea to make a crappy religion out of it too. LOL


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## Silveryou (Aug 31, 2021)

Hope you didn't see the clown IT


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## Rhayader (Aug 31, 2021)

There is much evidence our JC was Buddha. Christian Lindtner did great work translating the Greek and Sanskrit. Jesus is Buddha

I've pondered the Caesar link a few times though and it makes sense, but so do similarities with Horus, Mithra, Odin and others...


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## Apollonius (Aug 31, 2021)

Rhayader said:


> There is much evidence our JC was Buddha. Christian Lindtner did great work translating the Greek and Sanskrit. Jesus is Buddha
> 
> I've pondered the Caesar link a few times though and it makes sense, but so do similarities with Horus, Mithra, Odin and others...


Jesus Christ is already a *collage character* using the characters you mentioned (Buddha, Horus, Mithra etc.). The same is true for Buddha. Buddha is also a collage character assembled from previous characters.

But if we're looking for a real character, it should be Julius Caesar. With his physical appearance, his story completely *matches* the character of Jesus Christ. Jesus (Joshua of Nazareth) may also be pointing to a *celestial event*, as some friends have said, but we cannot be sure of that.

Also, the Christ character is a *conscious being* and one day everyone will reach Christ consciousness.


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## FarewellAngelina (Aug 31, 2021)

In Rome visiting the Coliseum with a college lecturer (intelligent chap) as a guide a few years ago . he showed us the spot where Julius Caesar was assassinated - just outside its walls . He told us that many people still lay flowers there every year on the anniversary . Seems less strange when the two JCs are linked .


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## Shabda Preceptor (Aug 31, 2021)

Apollonius said:


> Jesus Christ is already a *collage character* using the characters you mentioned (Buddha, Horus, Mithra etc.). The same is true for Buddha. Buddha is also a collage character assembled from previous characters.
> 
> But if we're looking for a real character, it should be Julius Caesar. With his physical appearance, his story completely *matches* the character of Jesus Christ. Jesus (Joshua of Nazareth) may also be pointing to a *celestial event*, as some friends have said, but we cannot be sure of that.
> 
> Also, the Christ character is a *conscious being* and one day everyone will reach Christ consciousness.


All of these "collages" as you call them go back even further to individuals. Mithra for example was never the original name or figure, and the characteristics mentioned weren't original either, nor even relevant to that religion, which began named differently, exactly when is debatable and depends on whom you ask, but in the end that religion goes back to Mahabad the first prophet. He was followed by a line of other prophets the last of whom ended up being the name of the religion, though using only the Greek version of the Persian name Zarathustra. I heard of the guy from an old Kurd who told me that he gained the story from his childhood, where these things were oral teachings among them from time immemorial, and that their history is passed down orally to each generation of children

Mahabad (prophet) - Wikipedia

For Mahabad, there is no life story or tale,  because he was thought to have lived so long ago (again, according to whom you ask) between roughly 8000 and 12,000 years ago. That date range of course disagrees with mainstream history who claims the religion to have sprung up less than 5000 years ago. Many centuries if not eons of records were lost when Alexander burned Persepolis (whether or not you believe the history we are all told is another matter entirely).

Now the Christ character, I'd disagree and say has never been an individual, but rather a multitude of them. It would be perhaps more accurate to say that it is a state of consciousness rather than an individual, whether physical or spiritual. I do not know if that was what you meant or not by "conscious being." But the rest of the sentence I agree with, it is a state that everyone arrives at eventually, but it is far from the final state. Of course everyone has their individual opinions about that as do most religions, but India has been making that clear for thousands of years, and while not necessarily the first to do so, have at the very least been speaking and teaching about the various states of consciousness/being for much longer than most other religions. In fact Buddhism is nothing but a "reformation" of Hinduism, and there have been a few of those, meaning that it began from within Hinduism before anyone ever decided to make a separate path or tradition out of it.

One funny thing however about Buddha, is that he is reputed to have been a white guy, not the sort of Eastern Asian as he is most often depicted, and also was never fat. That was a much later addition and not accepted by everyone. I read a book awhile back that claimed that he was Scythian, and it is well known that he was reputed to have been of the Shakya (Saka) clan who migrated to Nepal supposedly. But then according to this book, he left and traveled, eventually arriving in Babylon which was already a religious center by that time, and for numerous groups. He left before being slain by those that conquered the city, most likely other Persians, but supposedly (according to this book, which mainstream history does NOT accept or consider relevant) he left and by that time had made the expansion of consciousness into that same state described as Christ Consciousness (Buddha) as he went back to India where he eventually would have begun teaching. Obviously this version of his story isn't necessarily a collage, though as far as I know neither can it be absolutely proven, so it is just a theory. But one that changes his story a great deal from what has been commonly taught for 2500 years (according to the mainstream timeline of events).

So anyhow, just a couple of long winded distinctions, only one of which is even on topic, but the other (Christ) could never have been at all without the Persian influence (remember the 3 Magi??) who also had much to do with the Hebrews becoming monotheistic.


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## Silveryou (Sep 1, 2021)

FarewellAngelina said:


> He told us that many people still lay flowers there every year on the anniversary


I'm from Italy and I've never heard of that. It is probably just a small group of fanatics i suppose, if this story is even true!


Shabda Preceptor said:


> All of these "collages" as you call them go back even further to individuals. Mithra for example was never the original name or figure, and the characteristics mentioned weren't original either, nor even relevant to that religion, which began named differently, exactly when is debatable and depends on whom you ask, but in the end that religion goes back to Mahabad the first prophet. He was followed by a line of other prophets the last of whom ended up being the name of the religion, though using only the Greek version of the Persian name Zarathustra. I heard of the guy from an old Kurd who told me that he gained the story from his childhood, where these things were oral teachings among them from time immemorial, and that their history is passed down orally to each generation of children
> 
> Mahabad (prophet) - Wikipedia
> 
> For Mahabad, there is no life story or tale, because he was thought to have lived so long ago (again, according to whom you ask) between roughly 8000 and 12,000 years ago. That date range of course disagrees with mainstream history who claims the religion to have sprung up less than 5000 years ago. Many centuries if not eons of records were lost when Alexander burned Persepolis (whether or not you believe the history we are all told is another matter entirely).


Sorry but this Mahabad dude is just the typical made up story or recent duplicate just to confuse people in typical New Age fashion.

Buddha was regarded by Western explorers as a warlike god exactly like Odin. Its character has changed in time but the underlining image is the same.

But in any case all of this is just a distraction from the thread main argument, which is the extraordinary similarity between the _actions_ of the character called Jesus and the character called Caesar. These similarity cannot be ascribed entirely to astral matters, and 'spirituality', whatever this term means, has nothing to do with passing a river or saying the exact same phrases in certain circumstances. It is known the difficulty to prove the existence of the historical Jesus. Believers believe! So there's no point to confront them on this subject because they are satisfied with the few hints such as the Testimonium Flavianum.

Here some catchy phrases presumably pronounced by these two (Jesus was Caesar - Summary):


> _«He who does not take sides is on my side»_ reoccurs as _«For he that is not against us is for us.».
> «I am not King, I am Caesar»_ appears as _«We have no king but Caesar».
> «The best death is sudden death»_ appears as _«What you are going to do (lead me to death), do quickly».
> «Did I save them, that they might destroy me?»_ is _«He saved others; he cannot save himself.»_





> _«Alea iacta est(o)»,_ _«The die is cast»,_ became _«… casting (a net into the sea): for they were fishers»_ (confusion of lat. _*alea*,_ die, and gr. _*(h)aleeis*,_ fishers) – the miraculous netting of fish).
> _«Veni vidi vici»,_ _«I came, I saw, I conquered”,_ changed to _«I came, I washed and I saw.»_ (confusion of _*enikisa*,_ I won, and _*enipsa*,_ I washed) – the healing of the blind.


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## Shabda Preceptor (Sep 1, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> I'm from Italy and I've never heard of that. It is probably just a small group of fanatics i suppose, if this story is even true!
> 
> Sorry but this Mahabad dude is just the typical made up story or recent duplicate just to confuse people in typical New Age fashion.


Sorry, but numerous people say that you're wrong. You'll never find thousands of years of oral histories online however, but your inability to find any doesn't make it a new age creation. I know the guy and believe him, even if that is meaningless to you or anyone else, it still defies the so called "history" that is claimed. The number of prophets in that line varies, again depending on whom you ask, anywhere from 8 people  to 14. You are free to disagree, but yours is as much a belief as mine. Neither of us actually know the truth, because we just weren't there to witness any of the claimed teachings.



Silveryou said:


> Buddha was regarded by Western explorers as a warlike god exactly like Oden. Its character has changed in time but the underlining image is the same.
> 
> But in any case all of this is just a distraction from the thread main argument, which is the extraordinary similarity between the _actions_ of the character called Jesus and the character called Caesar. These similarity cannot be ascribed entirely to astral matters, and 'spirituality', whatever this term means, has nothing to do with passing a river or saying the exact same phrases in certain circumstances. It is known the difficulty to prove the existence of the historical Jesus. Believers believe! So there's no point to confront them on this subject because they are satisfied with the few hints such as the Testimonium Flavianum.
> 
> Here some catchy phrases presumably pronounced by these two (Jesus was Caesar - Summary):


I've never heard any group refer to Buddha as a god at all. If anyone ever did, that is news to me, but it still leaves the entirety of it as being questionable at best because no one knows for certain. The idea that he was an Aryan from a Scythian tribe however DOES make it entirely possible that he may have been a warrior, so if nothing else, that idea goes more toward supporting Buddha as a warrior. 

Be that as it may, I still have no conclusion as to Jesus and Caesar being the same individual or not, because IMO this one was out of left field. I'd not heard of it before. It remains open for discussion to me.


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## Silveryou (Sep 1, 2021)

Shabda Preceptor said:


> Neither of us actually know the truth, because we just weren't there to witness any of the claimed teachings.


So neither those who claim these half-assed 'oral' tales. No proof no glory. Sorry


Shabda Preceptor said:


> The idea that he was an Aryan from a Scythian tribe however DOES make it entirely possible that he may have been a warrior, so if nothing else, that idea goes more toward supporting Buddha as a warrior.


This is what tell those who went in those places. I am gonna post the source when I'll remember where I read it.


Shabda Preceptor said:


> Be that as it may, I still have no conclusion as to Jesus and Caesar being the same individual or not, because IMO this one was out of left field. I'd not heard of it before. It remains open for discussion to me.


Jesus and Caesar are for sure not the same character. The matter at hand is if they were the same individual. And this is hard to establish since there are believers on one side and people who presumably bring flowers on the presumed spot where Caesar died (!!!). But it's a fact proved by many instances that the two chareacters were based on the same individual. Caesar? Jesus? Another one? Let the bias run free.

EDIT: not "The matter at hand is if they were the same individual" but "The matter at hand is if the individual was Caesar, Jesus or someone else"


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## Shabda Preceptor (Sep 1, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> So neither those who claim this half-assed 'oral' tales. No proof no glory. Sorry


I was never going to get any glory from that anyhow. The fact remains however, that there IS a city in Iran named Mahabad. I very highly doubt that happened due to someone creating the character for some new agey goal, which also does NOT mean that no one ever did that, it only means that the individual is considered real enough that they renamed a city for him, although in recent times. Remember it is the Kurds only who say these things, and at this point they are a definite minority there. I don't doubt that you can find a source for a claimed creation of the name but what I do doubt is that is provides actual evidence. My story may be anecdotal, but that doesn't necessarily make it untrue. It can never be proven until someone figures out how to time travel and ask some Mede way back when, but it won't be me. It makes no difference to me.

It may only be hearsay now, but in Iran it is a well known fact that in their libraries, many writings about Mahabad were said to have existed until the Arab invasion from 633 A.D. to 653 A.D. according to mainstream history. This can be disputed, but it can't be disproven any more than any other story or claim could be. In the end, you go your way and I go mine. No one would have gotten any "glory" because it just isn't that important to anyone BUT the Kurds.


Silveryou said:


> This is what tell those who went in those places. I am gonna post the source when I'll remember where I read it.
> 
> Jesus and Caesar are for sure not the same character. The matter at hand is if they were the same individual. And this is hard to establish since there are believers on one side and people who presumably bring flowers on the presumed spot where Caesar died (!!!). But it's a fact proved by many instances that the two chareacters where based on the same individual. Caesar? Jesus? Another one? Let the bias run free.
> 
> EDIT: not "The matter at hand is if they were the same individual" but "The matter at hand is if the individual was Caesar, Jesus or someone else"


Many STILL argue that Jesus was Appolonius of Tyana. The council of Nicea disputed that. They had to because it didn't fit with their version of the approved Bible. No one will obviously ever know that they were or weren't the same, other than that Appolonius had no interest in the Hebrew God, he was more concerned with the Greek/Roman pantheon, depending on which source one reads. Some claim him to be Greek but he lived in Turkey which was a Roman province, so I've no clue about that. But he is claimed by several to have been an actual person, though I doubt any absolute proof exists to show that. But his story has a number of similarities to that of Jesus, and any consider them to be the same person. Off topic other than that this fact potentially indicates that he wasn't Caesar. I am only claiming that some believe them to be the same, proving that is just as impossible as most things are about events that far in the past. 

I have never looked into Caesar to any great extent, so I have no opinion concerning whether or not he existed or was Jesus. Not yet anyhow. So, on the discussion goes.


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## Silveryou (Sep 1, 2021)

Shabda Preceptor said:


> It may only be hearsay now, but in Iran it is a well known fact that in their libraries, many writings about Mahabad were said to have existed until the Arab invasion from 633 A.D. to 653 A.D. according to mainstream history. This can be disputed, but it can't be disproven any more than any other story or claim could be. In the end, you go your way and I go mine. No one would have gotten any "glory" because it just isn't that important to anyone BUT the Kurds.


This is as bogus as one can get. If you please yourself with this kind of tales so be it.


Shabda Preceptor said:


> Many STILL argue that Jesus was Appolonius of Tyana. The council of Nicea disputed that. They had to because it didn't fit with their version of the approved Bible. No one will obviously ever know that they were or weren't the same, other than that Appolonius had no interest in the Hebrew God, he was more concerned with the Greek/Roman pantheon, depending on which source one reads. Some claim him to be Greek but he lived in Turkey which was a Roman province, so I've no clue about that. But he is claimed by several to have been an actual person, though I doubt any absolute proof exists to show that. But his story has a number of similarities to that of Jesus, and any consider them to be the same person. Off topic other than that this fact potentially indicates that he wasn't Caesar. I am only claiming that some believe them to be the same, proving that is just as impossible as most things are about events that far in the past.


This is not what we are taliking about here. You can open a separate thread.


Shabda Preceptor said:


> I have never looked into Caesar to any great extent, so I have no opinion concerning whether or not he existed or was Jesus. Not yet anyhow. So, on the discussion goes.


This is the third time you say it. I posted links to keep you informed, if you want. And if not at this point I don't know what to say, since this thread is called _Was Jesus Caesar?_


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## Shabda Preceptor (Sep 1, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> This is as bogus as one can get. If you please yourself with this kind of tales so be it.


The Kurds disagree with you about that, but hey, whatever floats your boat. You haven't proven your claim either, so you have an opinion, nothing more. Congratulations.



Silveryou said:


> This is not what we are taliking about here. You can open a separate thread.
> 
> This is the third time you say it. I posted links to keep you informed, if you want. And if not at this point I don't know what to say, since this thread is called _Was Jesus Caesar?_





Silveryou said:


> This is as bogus as one can get. If you please yourself with this kind of tales so be it.
> 
> This is not what we are taliking about here. You can open a separate thread.
> 
> This is the third time you say it. I posted links to keep you informed, if you want. And if not at this point I don't know what to say, since this thread is called _Was Jesus Caesar?_


Yeah yeah, I read the link. I just don't really care that much. Have a nice day. Consider everything I mentioned dropped.


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## Silveryou (Sep 1, 2021)

Shabda Preceptor said:


> Congratulations


Thank you.


Shabda Preceptor said:


> You haven't proven your claim either, so you have an opinion, nothing more.


Neither you. You seem pretty good at invalidating other people's opinion with the relativity crap. And immediately after you propose some Winnie the Pooh theory based on the old man of the mountain village opinion. An example:


Shabda Preceptor said:


> Mithra for example was never the original name or figure, and the characteristics mentioned weren't original either, nor even relevant to that religion, which began named differently, exactly when is debatable and depends on whom you ask, but in the end that religion goes back to Mahabad the first prophet.


I'm not interested in your reply, because this thread is about Caesar-Jesus, but it's just to show you that you don't apply your relativity principles on yourself... and you actually modify well established Zoroastrian knowledge based on actual sources substituting it with village tales.


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## Apollonius (Sep 1, 2021)

In every thread, there is always someone trying to distort the topic, posting off-topic things.

Please let's talk only about *relevant things*.


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## AgentOrange5 (Sep 5, 2021)

Very interesting topic, I had never heard of this theory before. I will have to think about it some before voting. I guess I could vote that I don't know, but want to see if I develop a better opinion after pondering on this.


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## Silveryou (Sep 6, 2021)

_Julius Caesar,_ son of Venus and founder of the Roman Empire, was elevated to the status of Imperial God, _Divus Julius,_ after his violent death. The cult that surrounded him dissolved as Christianity surfaced.
A cult surrounding _Jesus Christ,_ son of God and originator of Christianity, appeared during the second century. Early historians, however, never mentioned Jesus and even now there is no actual proof of his existence.
On the one hand, an actual historical figure missing his cult, on the other, a cult missing its actual historical figure: intriguing mirror images.


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## piotrc (Sep 11, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> _Julius Caesar,_ son of Venus and founder of the Roman Empire, was elevated to the status of Imperial God, _Divus Julius,_ after his violent death. The cult that surrounded him dissolved as Christianity surfaced.
> A cult surrounding _Jesus Christ,_ son of God and originator of Christianity, appeared during the second century. Early historians, however, never mentioned Jesus and even now there is no actual proof of his existence.
> On the one hand, an actual historical figure missing his cult, on the other, a cult missing its actual historical figure: intriguing mirror images.


And he was Arian...


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## Jd755 (Sep 17, 2021)

To come back to the OP I see similarities and disparities in the tales but the tales seem to me to have a common source. Who that commons source is I do not know but I suspect what it is is the 'cult' for want of a better word, that seeks to foster the rule by authority. For me I have no idea what would pass as evidence for the existence of either character or the events attributed to them. I am utterly bereft of ideas about what forms of evidence I should be seeing to come to the balance of probability that these names were of people who lived breathed and died.
It is for this reason I call them characters.

What would you accept as good evidence or even proof incarnate, of either Julius Caesar or Jesus Christ existing as individual living beings at some point in history prior to today or even that they are simply storybook characters built on top of the real world exploits of some unknown historical character who may have existed as an individual living being?


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## Will Scarlet (Sep 18, 2021)

mega1000 said:


> My question on whether or nor someone was real is whether or not the events of their life could have taken place without them.



Surely the events of your life, for example, couldn't have taken place without your active participation, otherwise they would either be the events of someone else's life or never have occurred at all... or am I misunderstanding something?



mega1000 said:


> My understanding is Jesus doesn't need to be real because he only lived in a small part of the world and other people wrote about him. While Julius Caesar meanwhile conquered people.



The criteria for being 'real' then is mass murder, violence and the subjugation of other nations. Therefore, I don't need to be real either.

[PS: Please note, these comments are not made 'sarcastically', 'disrespectfully' or from any other kind of malice, merely from an attempt to further this discussion through greater mutual understanding.]


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## Sasyexa (Sep 19, 2021)

Interesting topic. There's a theory which localizes the events from the Bible in Europe:

_View: https://youtu.be/JzlHqmak78A_
​
Haven't watched it yet, but the name "France - Biblical Israel" seems to go along with the OP.

P.S. Found the first part:

_View: https://youtu.be/1MnQWny1gv0_

(10 hours!)​


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## alltheleaves (Sep 20, 2021)

Tony Gambino fingers the Pope as the godfather of the Mafia.
https://seed200.bitchute.com/wNZZkvylPP9c/yF9gVBdfA38P.mp4


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## Jd755 (Sep 20, 2021)

alltheleaves said:


> Tony Gambino fingers the Pope


Is he a certified registered medical practitioner perchance or just kinky?


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## Will Scarlet (Sep 20, 2021)

Second attempt:

My brother, Felix Noille, has recently done a major re-write of one of his earlier posts. In it he has managed to convince himself that the Normans and the Romans may well be one and the same entity. That's something he didn't set out to do. Anyway, he has always been sceptical of Roman history believing that the famous “ancient” 'Roman History' by Cornelius Tacitus was actually written by the Italian humanist Poggio Bracciolini (1380–1459) in the 15th century, as argued in 'Tacitus and Bracciolini. The Annals Forged in the XVth Century,' by John Wilson Ross (1818-1887). [Pdf available here.]

As for Jesus as a historical figure, he indicated in his 'Nature of the Beast' series that he thought it likely that the New Testament was a compilation and adaptation of Hellenistic romances which were very popular during the first centuries of the Christian era. The stories were “full of miracles, supernatural signs, cameo scenes with stock characters, plus aphorisms drawn from folklore and religious traditions - in short, a pastiche mixing fable and folk wisdom with realistic elements.”

So, are they one and the same person? *In my opinion*, yes and no. This may be difficult to explain and even more difficult to understand...

The question could also be asked: "Were Julius Caesar, Jesus Christ, William the Conqueror, King Arthur and Ogier le Dan the same person?" They all conform, to a greater or lesser extent, to archetypes that we all recognise - the Saviour, the Conqueror, the Liberator, the 'Once and Future King', etc., so then yes, they are the same 'person' or maybe 'personage' is a better term.

However, whether these personages were all ever really alive as individuals is another matter entirely. It would seem logical to assume that they are all based upon an 'original' - the one who 'cast the mould' so to speak - and who left such a deep and indelible impression upon the collective human psyche that it's still with us today.

It's curious that whoever that original was, they are no doubt hidden somewhere deep within mythology and yet the personages, like Jesus, Caesar etc., could actually be the myths. However, "some are born great, some achieve greatness, others have greatness thrust upon them." That last part should actually read "others have greatness *assigned to them*." (From "Twelfth Night," by that well known Italian, Shakespeare.)

These roles are obviously very familiar to those who seek to control humanity and so they are used against us. Portraying someone in one of these archetypal roles goes a long way to promoting their acceptance because we want a hero to come to our aid. For example, before 1066 and the Battle of Hastings, William the Conqueror was William the Bastard - not a good moniker for a 'hero'. The earlier title was far more appropriate actually, but obviously lacked the correct archetypal connection.

I'm sure there are many other examples.


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## alltheleaves (Sep 20, 2021)

Will Scarlet said:


> Second attempt:
> 
> My brother, Felix Noille, has recently done a major re-write of one of his earlier posts. In it he has managed to convince himself that the Normans and the Romans may well be one and the same entity. That's something he didn't set out to do. Anyway, he has always been sceptical of Roman history believing that the famous “ancient” 'Roman History' by Cornelius Tacitus was actually written by the Italian humanist Poggio Bracciolini (1380–1459) in the 15th century, as argued in 'Tacitus and Bracciolini. The Annals Forged in the XVth Century,' by John Wilson Ross (1818-1887). [Pdf available here.]
> 
> ...


Archetypes are similar to Tulpas. Tulpa - Wikipedia

Some tulpas can be life saving...


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## Silveryou (Sep 20, 2021)

Sasyexa said:


> Interesting topic. There's a theory which localizes the events from the Bible in Europe:
> 
> _View: https://youtu.be/JzlHqmak78A_
> ​
> ...



15 hours @Sasyexa you crazy man!!!

In any case, at some point there is a very interesting comment: the word_ ghetto_ is nothing else than a way of pronouncing our modern word _city_, _città _(Italian), _kitai _(Russian) and many others.
I've always thought that _ghetto _could be related to the word _gotha, _meaning 'the set of members of the aristocracy' and obviously related to the 'Goths' and ultimately the 'gods'. It fits very well with the concept of 'people dwelling in the most protected and exclusive part of the city'... the Ghetto.

Ghettos are frequently the most ancient, beautiful and well preserved parts of many European cities.
They were surrounded by tall and strong walls because historians want us to believe that Jews were imprisoned in those beautiful houses by the eeeevil christian nazeeees.
The poor Jews couldn't participate in the most beautiful jobs the world has ever seen, which the Pope granted to christians exclusevely. Professions such as working the land, going to the mine or dying in battle for the landlord and the Pope.
They had to be satisfied with their white-collar jobs (denied to christians for their salvation) which gave them free access to money and its sinful benefits.

My point of view, of which I am not certain at all...
If we imagine Caesar being Jesus, then the context changes too. Suddenly the Senate becomes the Sanhedrin, which elected a Pontifex Maximus (the Pope) to mediate between the aristocracy (the goths/gods) and the pueblo. That scumbag of a Caesar, member of the _Populares _faction, was a rebel Pope (Pontifex Maximus) who tried to extend rights to different communities and break the Sanhedrin overpower based upon money control and corruption.
After his assassination the Sanhedrin saw its power greatly diminished but not yet defeated. The Emperors inherited the Pontifex Maximus office making it an hereditary title, thus subtracting it to the Senate. The senators always opposed the Emperors' power until they invented Christianity as a puppet religion resulted from the cult of Caesar. The new christian Popes, elected in the Sanhedrin as the previous Pontifex Maximus, returned to do their ancient job adding a prey to the new Hebrew God incarnated who was really their arch-enemy.


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## Sasyexa (Sep 20, 2021)

I watched some of the interviews which were the basis for these 15 hours. Alexey Khrustalyov mentions a few interesting things:

Meaux, a French city not far from Paris corresponds to Emmaus, a Judean city not far from Jerusalem
Heavy Jewish and Arab presence in the general region of Iberian peninsula and France
The numerous French Jews used a French-Hebrew language, which is almost identical to the Old French. The Jewish sources from there contain French words (written with Hebrew letters) that weren't recorded in French sources
Events in the Gospel could be describing the conflict between two civilisations. One is European (could be Heathen or Catholic) and the other is Jewish-Arab
Some other toponyms like Iberian peninsula, Ebro river (from the word Hebrew)
According to apocryphal sources, Pontius Pilate was sent to Vienne, France and died there (different sources mention different places, but all in Gaul). His wife was born and had a childhood in Narbonne, also France.
A lot of other historical/biblical figures ended up in Gaul, like Joseph of Arimathea or Mary Magdalene (who could be named after a German city Magdala)
In Northern Italy, which was a part of Gaul, there is the river Po, which in ancient times was called Eridan (i.e. Jordan)
German city of Trier is also in the territory of the Gaul. The journey of the Helena (mother of Constantine) to Jerusalem from Trier is said to be one of the first sources mentioning Jerusalem. She was ~80 at the time, so the journey to France seems more reasonable than to Middle-East
Some things in France share the name with Longinus
A lot more here, this seems to be a huge rabbithole:
Шифр Библии взломан, и явилась сенсация: родина Христа - Франция. Фильм Первый | Путешествуем Сами. We Travel
Шифр Библии взломан, и явилась сенсация: родина Христа - Франция. Фильм Второй | Путешествуем Сами. We Travel
Шифр Библии взломан, и явилась сенсация: родина Христа - Франция. Фильм Третий | Путешествуем Сами. We Travel



Silveryou said:


> 15 hours @Sasyexa you crazy man!!!
> 
> In any case, at some point there is a very interesting comment: the word_ ghetto_ is nothing else than a way of pronouncing our modern word _city_, _città _(Italian), _kitai _(Russian) and many others.
> I've always thought that _ghetto _could be related to the word _gotha, _meaning 'the set of members of the aristocracy' and obviously related to the 'Goths' and ultimately the 'gods'. It fits very well with the concept of 'people dwelling in the most protected and exclusive part of the city'... the Ghetto.


Китай (Kitai) means China, the city is город (gorod). However, there is a region in Moscow called Kitay-gorod which follows your definition of a ghetto:



> Kitay-gorod (Russian: Китай-город, IPA: [kʲɪˈtaj ˈɡorət]), also referred to as the Great Possad (Russian: Великий Посад) in the 16th–17th centuries, is a cultural and historical area within the central part of Moscow in Russia, defined by the remnants of now almost entirely razed fortifications, narrow streets and very densely built cityscape. It is separated from the Moscow Kremlin by Red Square. Kitay-gorod does not constitute a district (raion), as there are no resident voters, thus, municipal elections are not possible. Rather, the territory has been part of Tverskoy District, and the Central Administrative Okrug authorities have managed the area directly since 2003.
> ​Etymology​Beside Kitai-gorod in Moscovia in ancient Russia, Kitai was also a name for a sea. A sea called Kitai exists in Odessa in Ukraine. In older sources it was described that compared to other ethnic groups of Russia dark-skinned people sold goods and traded with other peoples at the area of the Kitai sea.
> 
> Kita (pl. kity) is a somewhat obsolete word for "plait" or "an item made by braiding". A 17th-century Russian source states "У шапок янычары имели киты" ("U shapok yanychary imeli kity"), meaning "The Janissaries had braids hanging from their caps". In his 1967 book Rise of Russia, author Robert Wallace asserts that the term might mean a rough-hewn defensive bulwark made from woven wicker baskets filled with earth or rock – and thus Kitay-gorod means "Basket city". Kitay could also be derived from an old word for the wooden stakes used in construction of the quarter's walls. Gorod is simply the Russian word for "city", derived from the ancient gord.
> ...


A Chinatown in 16th century Moscow?

Another interesting thing about the word God is that in Russian there is a similarly sounding word гад. It means snake or bastard (not the illegitimate child, but a bad person).


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## Silveryou (Sep 20, 2021)

Sasyexa said:


> Китай (Kitai) means China, the city is город (gorod).


Yeah, I know. But in the first video (the second... the 5 hours one) at 48:05 he talks about this interpretation, which I find incredibly spot on.


Sasyexa said:


> In Northern Italy, which was a part of Gaul, there is the river Po, which in ancient times was called Eridan (i.e. Jordan)


I've always thought this identification a little weird, since the plain around the river is called Padana, from the Padus river (today Po), from which derives the name of the city of Padova (Padua)... or maybe the other way around.
A better candidate is the Rhone river: Latin Rhodanus. Was 'Eridan' just a different pronunciation (or a mispronunciation)?
Or maybe even the Rhine river (Rhenus), which is another river with its own mythology.


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## Sasyexa (Sep 20, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> Yeah, I know. But in the first video (the second... the 5 hours one) at 48:05 he talks about this interpretation, which I find incredibly spot on.
> 
> I've always thought this identification a little weird, since the plane around the river is called Padana, from the Padus river (today Po), from which derives the name of the city of Padova (Padua)... or maybe the other way around.
> A better candidate is the Rhone river: Latin Rhodanus. Was 'Eridan' just a different pronunciation (or a mispronunciation)?
> Or maybe even the Rhine river (Rhenus), which is another river with its own mythology.


Interesting, wiki tells three of those rivers are connected too
Witenwasserenstock - Wikipedia

P.S. Apparently, the local name for middle-eastern Jordan is _Nahr Al Sharieat_


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## Silveryou (Sep 20, 2021)

Sasyexa said:


> P.S. Apparently, the local name for middle-eastern Jordan is _Nahr Al Sharieat_


You once again read my mind! I think that Rhodanus name was simply Rhone and not the other way around. The Latin word probably means 'Rhone river', since 'dan' (in its various similar spellings) meant 'river' in the so-called Proto-Indo-European (Reconstruction:Proto-Indo-European/dʰenh₂- - Wiktionary). Don, Dniester, Danube are probably the most famous examples.

So what about the Jor-*dan*?


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## Sasyexa (Sep 20, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> You once again read my mind! I think that Rhodanus name was simply Rhone and not the other way around. The Latin word probably means 'Rhone river', since 'dan' (in its various similar spellings) meant 'river' in the so-called Proto-Indo-European (Reconstruction:Proto-Indo-European/dʰenh₂- - Wiktionary). Don, Dniester, Danube are probably the most famous examples.
> 
> So what about the Jor-*dan*?


Exactly! A quote from another post:


Sasyexa said:


> Don is a stable name for any rivers in Russian language.



All of those names seem to originate from the word meaning "red", like you said about Rubicon. This river system was universally considered red for some reason (blood, the setting sun?)


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## Will Scarlet (Sep 21, 2021)

alltheleaves said:


> Archetypes are similar to Tulpas. Tulpa - Wikipedia



They sound more like thought-forms than archetypes, imo.


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## Jd755 (Sep 21, 2021)

Sasyexa said:


> All of those names seem to originate from the word meaning "red",


Or sounded 'red' but actually meant 'read' as in understanding. Misinterpreted in the action of putting sound into writing?
Would make much more sense to understand a river by reading it as in experiencing it over time.


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## alltheleaves (Sep 21, 2021)

Will Scarlet said:


> They sound more like thought-forms than archetypes, imo.


ya. I meant thought form...group mind of millions over milennia.


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## Sasyexa (Sep 21, 2021)

alltheleaves said:


> ya. I meant thought form...group mind of millions over milennia.


An egregore?


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## Will Scarlet (Sep 22, 2021)

alltheleaves said:


> ya. I meant thought form...group mind of millions over milennia.



I always envisioned archetypes as combining the essence of a thought-form with the nature of the characters in the major and minor Arcanas of the Tarot.



Sasyexa said:


> An egregore?



Vadim Zeland referred to them as Pendulums in his 'Reality Transurfing' series, but *personally *I wouldn't call them archetypes.


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## Silveryou (Sep 22, 2021)

Sasyexa said:


> What happened to the videos? @Silveryou, did you do a backup, perhaps? It seems people don't like this topic for some reason. In that case, here's a translation of the original documentaries:
> 
> *First part*​
> *Alexei Khrustalev*. Traditionally the New Testament places are considered to be the territories of present-day Israel, Palestine, Syria, Jordan, and Lebanon yet. However, no clear evidence of this has yet been found. There are some piles of shards, or there are some stones, they are immediately and happily written in the minus 20th century or minus 30th century, but any real, any really interesting finds that would unequivocally confirm the Old Testament or New Testament history in Israel are practically nonexistent.
> ...


It was Youtube's logarithm retaliation for the 15h


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## Sasyexa (Sep 22, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> It was Youtube's logarithm retaliation for the 15h


The videos were up for quite a long time. I found the link to them a few months ago here, maybe in the archives. Maybe jewtube execs are reading our threads to see what videos must be deleted?
I suggest to pin this thread to the front page to piss them off

P.S. I remember now, those videos were from 2017


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## alltheleaves (Sep 23, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> 15 hours @Sasyexa you crazy man!!!
> 
> In any case, at some point there is a very interesting comment: the word_ ghetto_ is nothing else than a way of pronouncing our modern word _city_, _città _(Italian), _kitai _(Russian) and many others.
> I've always thought that _ghetto _could be related to the word _gotha, _meaning 'the set of members of the aristocracy' and obviously related to the 'Goths' and ultimately the 'gods'. It fits very well with the concept of 'people dwelling in the most protected and exclusive part of the city'... the Ghetto.
> ...


I called a church for advice once and they told me render to caesar.

Download youtubes at 360p with y2mate and upload them to archive.org


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## trismegistus (Sep 23, 2021)

Some posts from this thread have been moved to a new thread.

Update: thread is now revised and unlocked for replies

France - Biblical Israel


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## Apollonius (Sep 23, 2021)

Those who think that Jesus Christ was not Julius Caesar should think again.

Such similarity *cannot* be a coincidence. There is definitely a connection between these two characters.


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## luddite (Sep 24, 2021)

Apollonius said:


> These two people, who are physically similar,


Could also be Cesare Borgia (September 13, 1475 – March 11, 1507), second son of Pope Alexander the 6th of Rome. According to the French writer Alexandre Dumas and others, his likeness was used as the model for the long blonde haired, blue eyed, effeminate looking Christ.


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## Silveryou (Dec 6, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> Buddha was regarded by Western explorers as a warlike god exactly like Odin. Its character has changed in time but the underlining image is the same.





Shabda Preceptor said:


> The idea that he was an Aryan from a Scythian tribe however DOES make it entirely possible that he may have been a warrior, so if nothing else, that idea goes more toward supporting Buddha as a warrior.





Silveryou said:


> This is what tell those who went in those places. I am gonna post the source when I'll remember where I read it.


I took the info from Fomenko/Nosovsky's History: Fiction or Science vol. 4 (3.1. “The Voyage beyond the Three Seas” by Afanasiy Nikitin):

“The entire populace of India has the custom of
congregating at the butkhan … the numbers of people
azar lek vakht bashet sat azare lek. There is a large
effigy of But [Buddha] at the butkhan, carved in stone
and resembling Justinian of Czar-Grad with a spear
in his hand”

By the way, the fact that the statue of Buddha
should wield a spear and resemble the effigy of Justinian,
the Byzantine emperor leads us to the theory
that the Indian “Buddha cult” had partially incorporated
the cult of Batu-Khan, the great conqueror,
hence the use of the word butkhan (Batu-Khan).

I didn't remember correctly though, since Nikitin compared Buddha to the Emperor Justinian! It's in any case peculiar the resemblance Buddha/Wotan, Agartha/Asgard and Asura/Aesir


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## Daniel (Dec 6, 2021)

And "Asgard" is the same name as "Czargrad".
If we remember that many old texts were written using just consonants, and perhaps an understanding of the vowel sounds.
It's s/z-g-r-d, with two "a" vowel sounds.
Depending on where you place the a's , you get either "Czargrad" or "Asgard". In fact, the two a's simply each moved one place to the left.


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## piotrc (Dec 6, 2021)

Honestly Jesus Christ was fully derived of multiple deities (like Mitra, Osiris) around 4th century as a result of Constantine's order. Please read what council of Nice brought and what exactly was discussed and agreed there. I think that asking the topic question 'Was Jesus Christ a Julius Caesar?' is misleading. It's like asking 'who is your idol and why Lenin?'


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## Daniel (Dec 6, 2021)

However, the idea of a "4th century" was only created long after the "4th century".
It's more likely that these "multiple deities" are all derived from a single figure. Mithras, Osiris, Jesus Christ, and others all have a single human figure as their inspiration.


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## piotrc (Dec 6, 2021)

Daniel said:


> However, the idea of a "4th century" was only created long after the "4th century".
> It's more likely that these "multiple deities" are all derived from a single figure. Mithras, Osiris, Jesus Christ, and others all have a single human figure as their inspiration.


Whenever the council of Nice really happened, please read what happened there (info is available, church statements too). Who met there, how long it took and what was discussed and approved. Interesting thing is what the people of that times thought about it, and how were the priests seen\received by societies before it happened.


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## Daniel (Dec 6, 2021)

I'd have to refer you back to Johnson's "Pauline Epistles" where he makes the point that there were no Christian Councils prior to the Council of Tr(id)ent.
And all the discussions allegedly held, anddecisions allegedly reached, in the "4th century" were being discussed/argued "over a thousand years later", with no hint that any such issues had ever been brought up before. And there was certainly no "over a thousand years of Christian tradition".


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## Silveryou (Dec 6, 2021)

Daniel said:


> And "Asgard" is the same name as "Czargrad".
> If we remember that many old texts were written using just consonants, and perhaps an understanding of the vowel sounds.
> It's s/z-g-r-d, with two "a" vowel sounds.
> Depending on where you place the a's , you get either "Czargrad" or "Asgard". In fact, the two a's simply each moved one place to the left.


And consequently the Aesir were the C-Aesir aka Caesars.


piotrc said:


> I think that asking the topic question 'Was Jesus Christ a Julius Caesar?' is misleading. It's like asking 'who is your idol and why Lenin?'


It is not. It's trying to figure out what living human being was at the core of the earthly life of the character Jesus. And 'Caesar' is the most accurate answer afaik, as shown by Carotta and Atwill.


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## piotrc (Dec 6, 2021)

Silveryou said:


> And consequently the Aesir were the C-Aesir aka Caesars.
> 
> It is not. It's trying to figure out what living human being was at the core of the earthly life of the character Jesus. And 'Caesar' is the most accurate answer afaik, as shown by Carotta and Atwill.


Did you check how /why J Christ came to exist and when? As the Caesar was popular, he might have been included as one of dozens of deities included into Christ's picture. In general the Bible is one huge manipulation, unrelated with real history, it's visible as you read it - New Testament is super fake and inconsistent. Even Vatican do not deny it.


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## Silveryou (Dec 6, 2021)

piotrc said:


> Did you check how /why J Christ came to exist and when?


I'm curious about your own _opinion_.


piotrc said:


> As the Caesar was popular, he *might have been included* as one of dozens of deities included into Christ's picture.


If you read the posts following the OP you can find links to Carotta and Atwill to better understand what we are talking about. Caesar was elevated to the rank of living God shortly after his death: Divus Caesar.


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## Blackdiamond (Dec 6, 2021)

Daniel said:


> And "Asgard" is the same name as "Czargrad".
> If we remember that many old texts were written using just consonants, and perhaps an understanding of the vowel sounds.
> It's s/z-g-r-d, with two "a" vowel sounds.
> Depending on where you place the a's , you get either "Czargrad" or "Asgard". In fact, the two a's simply each moved one place to the left.


and the "As-people" came from the east as well. 
also, both iulius and caesar (=Czar) became titles later, or were they always titles / ranks?


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## piotrc (Dec 6, 2021)

Blackdiamond said:


> and the "As-people" came from the east as well.
> also, both iulius and caesar (=Czar) became titles later, or were they always titles / ranks?


Czar still has a meaning in polish. Czara is a bowl or a goblet, but Czar today means here: spell, glamour, charm. Next to the Black sea there is a smaller sea of Azow. In my language it means 'sea of the As', but that's just my notice. Never checked if it's really related to As people. Asgard in russian/polish sounds like 'As city' or 'As castle'. Just a lousy guess.


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## kirass (Nov 11, 2022)

First off Yeshua Ben Joseph was not a Jew. This might be the biggest shocker for most of you. But he was actually born amongst a group of people known as Arimatheans. They were a mostly red haired people that actually settled in the area of Galilee that came from the British Isles. They settled in the area around the port of Stratom/Kratom, which also happened to be the location of the University of the Magi. You don't know about these people anymore because the Romans literally genocided them, it also has a lot to do with why the Irish were mostly turned into slaves by the world's ruling elite.

Yeshua's mother, Mary was actually born to a very wealthy family with ties to royalty. Mary's brother was Joseph of Arimathea, although he is only mentioned in the Bible nowadays as the rich man that paid for Jesus's funeral. Joseph of Arimathea was a incredibly rich Tin baron. He ran a trade network that supplied nearly half the world at that time with Tin, during a time when Bronze was one of the most used metals on Earth. He had mines in the Cornwall region of England. He had his own navy and military, very similar to the European Trading Companies of a few hundred years ago that colonized large parts of the world.
---
Finally in 325 AD, Emperor Constantine had the Bible formed and tried to bring the Christians back into the fold, but the Bible was a false creation containing much of the doctrine of the Fallen Angels and Reptilians that still rule this world.

Did you know the original Christians taught Reincarnation? And it wasn't until 553 AD when the afterlife concept was changed to Heaven/Hell? Emperor Justinian and Empress Theodora called on the Pope to change the doctrine after countless people across Europe began killing themselves instead of becoming slaves to the new rulers. Because they were losing so many workers, they told the Pope to change it. He said no, so he lost his head. Eventually they found a Pope that agreed, and the rest is history.
r/HeimdallsWisdom - Who was Jesus Christ?


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## TruthIsOnlyDelayed (Nov 11, 2022)

kirass said:


> First off Yeshua Ben Joseph was not a Jew. This might be the biggest shocker for most of you. But he was actually born amongst a group of people known as Arimatheans. They were a mostly red haired people that actually settled in the area of Galilee that came from the British Isles. They settled in the area around the port of Stratom/Kratom, which also happened to be the location of the University of the Magi. You don't know about these people anymore because the Romans literally genocided them, it also has a lot to do with why the Irish were mostly turned into slaves by the world's ruling elite.
> 
> Yeshua's mother, Mary was actually born to a very wealthy family with ties to royalty. Mary's brother was Joseph of Arimathea, although he is only mentioned in the Bible nowadays as the rich man that paid for Jesus's funeral. Joseph of Arimathea was a incredibly rich Tin baron. He ran a trade network that supplied nearly half the world at that time with Tin, during a time when Bronze was one of the most used metals on Earth. He had mines in the Cornwall region of England. He had his own navy and military, very similar to the European Trading Companies of a few hundred years ago that colonized large parts of the world.
> ---
> ...


A lot of claims here - can you source some of them please?


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## kirass (Nov 14, 2022)

TruthIsOnlyDelayed said:


> A lot of claims here - can you source some of them please?


For me, this is the most truthful narrative, and there is quite a lot of historical evidence about Joseph - you will find it here in Russian, but with Google, I think you will understand.
Иосиф Аримафейский


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## JimDuyer (Nov 14, 2022)

Wow.  I'll leave my comments on the Old Testament aside, because that's a whole nother story as they say, and most of its problems are the result of helpful but stupid translators...  But please.  

Read some of what Jesus proposed - his sayings are evident and while not clear to all that's because the deeper meanings were not meant for all.  But examine what we know . Julius Caesar was the butcher of Gaul - he bragged about slaughtering a million people from there alone, most of them women and children.  He's a coward and the best comparison to him would be Satan, or possible one of the early Popes.  How could you possibly compare him to Jesus?


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## Silveryou (Nov 14, 2022)

JimDuyer said:


> Wow.  I'll leave my comments on the Old Testament aside, because that's a whole nother story as they say, and most of its problems are the result of helpful but stupid translators...  But please.
> 
> Read some of what Jesus proposed - his sayings are evident and while not clear to all that's because the deeper meanings were not meant for all.  But examine what we know . Julius Caesar was the butcher of Gaul - he bragged about slaughtering a million people from there alone, most of them women and children.  He's a coward and the best comparison to him would be Satan, or possible one of the early Popes.  How could you possibly compare him to Jesus?


The best way to do the comparison is to actually read the book and then comment. As always every thread in this forum is always destined to become garbage as time pass by.
Here's the website Francesco Carotta - Homepage


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