# Carving beyond possibilities.



## Citezenship (Mar 21, 2021)

So this is a new video from one of my favourite makers.

https://www.youtube.com/user/thedove67/featured
It's really very well put together and has a haunting soundtrack.


_View: https://youtu.be/IkZkfRE_srI_


I did not know which section it should go into but here are some related threads.

https://stolenhistory.net/search/40182/?q=statues&o=relevance


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## bbulz (Mar 21, 2021)

It's like they used some sort of photo technique


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## JWW427 (Mar 21, 2021)

Its said that consciousness can create matter.
Is this a clue?
Did the ancients understand this concept?
Did they soften the stone with sound vibration until it was as soft as clay?


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## Luz Bella (Mar 22, 2021)

They are incredible! But they were not sculpted. They were modeled. 

It is said that Bernini (if he really existed) had a technique whereby the marble bent in his hands and was flexible like modeling clay, according to witnesses. 

There was a technique with which marble paste was made and these "sculptures" were molded. 

Columns in buildings were also covered on the outside to make them look like solid marble. In some of them, in Rome, the marble shell has fallen in some parts and you can see the rock underneath.

Those impressive veils on the figures were obtained with that smooth marble paste that was placed on the figure, as if it were a real sheet. They let it harden and Voilá! We have a real beauty! 

Who has this technique now? I do not know. 

With what did they soften the marble? They did not soften it. It was a paste or "dough" made of marble dust mixed with some liquid that later hardened after hours or days.

Whatever: sculpted or modeled, they are truly breathtakingly beautiful!!!

 More beauties like these should be in our modern cities riddled with obscenities called "urban art" which is synonymous with ugliness and disharmony...that is contagious to the human soul.


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## Citezenship (Mar 22, 2021)

JWW427 said:


> Its said that consciousness can create matter.
> Is this a clue?
> Did the ancients understand this concept?
> Did they soften the stone with sound vibration until it was as soft as clay?


Maybe they had CAD on their laptops.....


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## luddite (Mar 22, 2021)

Luz Bella said:


> With what did they soften the marble? They did not soften it. It was a paste or "dough" made of marble dust mixed with some liquid that later hardened after hours or days.


Pyramid stones and geopolymers, waterways with poured concrete, improbably huge monolith's and what you mention really makes me think that most of what we see is simply the result of molding techniques.

We need to test this! Who will try?



Citezenship said:


> Maybe they had CAD on their laptops.....


I don't know if I've see that picture before but it seems familiar and is fascinating!! Who/where is it from...


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## Citezenship (Mar 22, 2021)

luddite said:


> I don't know if I've see that picture before but it seems familiar and is fascinating!! Who/where is it from...


Unfortunately I do not know it's source as it is a screenshot from a vid, but I too have seen it before.


_View: https://youtu.be/dAidb4Rfm4w_


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## luddite (Mar 22, 2021)

Found it: 

*The statue is ‘Grave Naiskos of an Enthroned Woman with an Attendant'*








They even had blenders back then! ;-)


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## Citezenship (Mar 22, 2021)

luddite said:


> They even had blenders back then! ;-)


Underpants came later?


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## fega72 (Mar 22, 2021)

Maybe they had CAD on their laptops.....

View attachment 7714​[/QUOTE]
Definitely not USB ports. USB ports are rectangular.


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## Luz Bella (Mar 23, 2021)

Here two accounts of a plant in South America that softens rock. One of them from Colonel Percy Fawcett. 

(I've heard of the existence of this plant before, but I don't remember when or where). 

The plant that softens stone.


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## MgvdT (Mar 29, 2021)

View attachment Ratto.jpgIn addition to the podcast:





Copyright: Anna Chromy

https://annachromy.com/cloak/monumental-cloak/
''Creating a sculpture from such a large block of marble was never going to be easy. Here, over a five year span, we document with pictures, just what was involved, from the Michelangelo Quarry, where the block came from, to its completion five years later at the Michelangelo Studio, Carrarra, Italy''





Copyright: Anna Chromy





Copyright: Anna Chromy



View attachment Ratto.jpg
Copyright: Anna Chromy

A truly amazing modern achievement from a great artist.
Carved between 2005/2011. Check out her website for more pictures, note the power tools, the additional people helping and how long it took to complete.


'*'Ratto di Prosperina''*

View attachment Ratto.jpg





1621-1622
Gian Lorenzo Bernini
109 CM exc base.
Done without power tools.

A lot smaller compared to the cloak. What are your opinions on
-Finding of the right block of marble
-Carving and perfecting
-The time frame






*Veiled Christ
Guiseppe Sanmartino
1753(?)*


As mentioned in the Carving beyond possibilities. there are plants to soften certain stone and rocks. Would they have known about that as well?


^All fun and dandy, but what do the Dutch have to say about this?!

Well as it turns out, the *Wonderen der Natuyr *has some opinions on the matter.

I'm going to reference to chapter thirtheen here (hehe)

XIII. HOOFTSTUK.
Van Bronnen, vlietende Water -beeken , en ftilftaande Wateren, die alles wat fy aanroeren, met een fteene fchorfle overtrekken , of t'eenemaal in Steen veranderen en zelf tot steen worden.

*About (water)sources, waterways, not moving water, who everything they touch, wrap in stone bark, or completely turn to stone; or turn to stone themselves.








Source: Wonderen der Natuyr, of een Beschryvingh van de wonderlÄ³ke geschapenheyt der Natuyr, des Hemelsche Firmaments, Sterren, Planeten en Cometen; alsmede van dese sichtbare Wereldt en der Zee mitsgaders van vele opmerkelÄ³ke wonderen..., bronnen, rivieren..., planten en kruyden uyt veele geloofwaardige schryvers by een vergadert ... door J.H.S.M.F : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive
*note in the second version of the book from +-100 years later they still have the same information. I will add some translations later but I am having a hard time with my pc right now.

Chapter 10 is entirely about humans, animals and other living creatures turning to stone as well.


And those are just a few examples of the known water back in the day.


Authors note: honestly this can't really be a surprise for the most of you I hope.



I will adjust this post later on as my pc is really giving me a hard time.

Have a great day and thank you for reading.
M


davtash said:


> luddite said:
> 
> 
> > Every week or so we aim to have three hosts go through some popular threads. Hopefully a thread creator can do a guest spot also.
> ...




Thank you for the feedback. It was a first for all of us, so we will learn along the way. For me personally, I found it hard to share some of the information I've found without throwing my own opinion in the mix and let the viewer/listener decide for themselves.




luddite said:


> davtash said:
> 
> 
> > luddite said:
> ...




And we applaud you for it!

Have a great day!
M


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## Will Scarlet (Mar 29, 2021)

MgvdT said:


> For me personally, I found it hard to share some of the information I've found without throwing my own opinion in the mix and let the viewer/listener decide for themselves.



Yes, I did notice that.


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## MgvdT (Apr 6, 2021)

MgvdT said:


> View attachment 7831In addition to the podcast:
> 
> 
> View attachment 7813
> ...




That's all fine and dandy but what do the Dutch, Oh sorry. I already did that, huh?

So i was looking for recipes to 'soften' stone. 
I've found many recipes on softening a bunch of stuff (ivory, metal, gold etc).
But what about stone?


Aaaand I found one:





''To soften all hard rocks
Take oxblood, and sheep fat, with strong wine vinegar, leave the stone in there the entire night''

(I haven't tested the recipe.)





Work upon it as if it was wax, eh?

Could it be possible a technique to soften the stone was used to make the work a bit easier?

Let me know your thoughts, thank you for reading and have a great day!
M


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## luddite (Jul 22, 2021)

MgvdT said:


> ''To soften all hard rocks
> Take oxblood, and sheep fat, with strong wine vinegar, leave the stone in there the entire night''



This sounds delicious. I will add this to my list of things to test.


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## MgvdT (Aug 2, 2021)

Just came across this little mention, I've gotta find this book..
Aldrovanus (writer) - Metallijke schatkamer (name of the book). Has an entire chapter on turning stuff to stone. 
This book references Aldrovanus describes it in chapter 62 of book 4. 

''We could, in this book now withhold this information, which caused us the greatest wonderment, the following, that all things, be them from the animals, the plants, the humans, or other, by working nature, can turn to stone''

I can't find it anywhere. If anybody finds it, let me know, i'll translate it.

M


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## Citezenship (Aug 2, 2021)

I don't think it is but came up as a reference.

https://books.googleusercontent.com...uWdGWETGHdomkaAoaWJCPIAPUfGkmpN8DfDWv1TyJDnng


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## enthusiast (Aug 2, 2021)

MgvdT said:


> I've found many recipes on softening a bunch of stuff (ivory, metal, gold etc).


Please share the links.


MgvdT said:


> Chapter 10 is entirely about humans, animals and other living creatures turning to stone as well.


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## MgvdT (Aug 2, 2021)

Citezenship said:


> I don't think it is but came up as a reference.
> 
> https://books.googleusercontent.com...uWdGWETGHdomkaAoaWJCPIAPUfGkmpN8DfDWv1TyJDnng


Thank you, where did you find it? For some reason I can't open it.

*403.* That’s an error.

Your client does not have permission to get URL /books/content?req=AKW5QafDT3ey7BrF00bzobb-Mp35ybkLV2FOH_vNrM9BEPwiZM57CL-dWa7ywuJ71QD-FNzjXD7EVvi7TQaw-5nbJ9RUBXrkPJ75VDXxwYbxo3GXNloHukXizKu5g4NnKDwND5z227jBljqDRBKx4pm7yi8NiIDpsjDs-3M2s3IjhKsTZfgHfMD6JH0mzABHSqMQuJW_VCEAIXyT2y3vC8Aj9bT9qCpfp1-4EwgG2xk-lUOmlWNkxIVmPrfAmL8kjvttqStkpOuWdGWETGHdomkaAoaWJCPIAPUfGkmpN8DfDWv1TyJDnng from this server. That’s all we know.

Thanks, google!


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## Citezenship (Aug 2, 2021)

Google Translate


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## enthusiast (Aug 2, 2021)

MgvdT said:


> Aldrovanus (writer) - Metallijke schatkamer (name of the book)


Ulisse Aldrovandi - "Mvsaevm metallicvm" (?) or book in "amshistorica".
Ulisse Aldrovandi - Wiki.


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## MgvdT (Aug 2, 2021)

enthusiast said:


> Ulisse Aldrovandi - "Mvsaevm metallicvm" (?) or book in "amshistorica".
> Ulisse Aldrovandi - Wiki.


Thank you! I'll see what I can dig up from here.


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