Flat Earth

[GandalfTheGreen]

Can you provide a single proof that 60 degrees north and 60 degrees south are anywhere near the same distance?

How about 45 north and south?

30 perhaps?

Thanks


I literally, just yesterday, showed you how wrong you were.

I'm still waiting on the "Flat Earthers" to demonstrate that the physical, mechanical navigation techniques used for the last... 500+ years are incorrect, however the tropics are still navigated as if they are 2 bodies of equal distance.

Can you demonstrate the tropics are infact different sizes? (I think we both already know that answer.) Because if you can, then we can easily go through hundreds of years of captains logs, and point out "hey, they had to have double the supplies in order to travel this distance; and therfore we can demonstrate that they were lying!"

Unfortunately, the reality of the situation is that IN REALITY, the tropics are equal in size. Unless you can prove that they aren't, which no flat earther has done in the last 6 years, despite their good intentions.

Questioning the rug I stand on, after I've pulled the rug out from under you, doesn't make your rug appear back under neath your feet any faster. However, questioning the quality of the rug you were standing on, is how you got started in "Flat" Earth to begin with. Have you bothered to question the size of the tropics? How they are navigated as equally sized bodies?

If so, why is it flat earthers can't demonstrate that in reality they are 2 different sizes? Is it because.... In reality, they aren't?


I also noticed you didn't even bother to discuss my point about the luminaries above us and their REQUIRED increase in acceleration/deceleration over the transit of "Flat Earth." Is this because, in reality we know it doesn't work that way? The Eye is only good for Appearance.

Appollonius a question if I may make so bold.
You know the earth to have a shape which you know is a three dimensional ball. This seems to be a fair assessment based on your postings here in this thread.
So why do you come into this thread, is it to have a laugh, show off, ridicule or something else?

Genuinely interested.

I'm sure he'll answer this, but I'll go ahead and reply anyway.

Because we know you guys have discovered "the lie." But what you haven't discovered yet, is "The truth." And while you are doing the best you can to pursue "The truth" you are failing yourselves in your pursuits because you have forsaken reality for what your eye and appearance tells you.

Reality, is a physically navigable thing. Do you not find it odd that there is no phsycial navigational proof for "flat earth" other than airplane routes? Do you not find it odd that literally, the only form of navigation to work with the AE projection is Flight? Occam's razor always applies. There is a reason the apparent horizon is always rising to eye level. Flat things don't rise physically or mechanically.

 

[Apollonius]

Appollonius a question if I may make so bold.
You know the earth to have a shape which you know is a three dimensional ball. This seems to be a fair assessment based on your postings here in this thread.
So why do you come into this thread, is it to have a laugh, show off, ridicule or something else?

Genuinely interested.

I'm here to show you believe in something nonsense, and don't worry I'll always be here.

I literally, just yesterday, showed you how wrong you were.

You didn't show me anything, and you didn't even debunk a single one of my arguments.

If you want to deceive yourself, go ahead, but if you want to know the truth, open your mind and listen to other ideas.

 

[Blackdiamond]

60 degree N and 60 degree S could be equal distance on a flat earth?

 

[Jd755]

Appolonius thank you for your answer. It is appreciated. You do know this forum is primarily a forum about historical things so do you have anything historical to add to this thread in regards the earth shape theories?

Edit to add.
Sorry I missed your assumption in your reply. Just for clarity do not believe in any earth shape theory nor do I know if it has or needs one.

 

[Apollonius]

60 degree N and 60 degree S could be equal distance on a flat earth?

If we just take the Mercator projection as a Flat Earth map, the answer to your question is yes.

 

[Blackdiamond]

If we just take the Mercator projection as a Flat Earth map, the answer to your question is yes.

View attachment 19672

Im sure fairly it isnt a square. Not exactly what i meant. The proportion could be wrong on your idea of a flat earth, making the south longer distance. Anyway, im not a flat earther, speedy guy on YT steered me away from it all. Im content with the idea it is expanding and the opposit, like a pulse / wave, dont know about shape.
It would be historical if it turned out to be flat though.

 

[otl2021]

I'm still waiting on the "Flat Earthers" to demonstrate that the physical, mechanical navigation techniques used for the last... 500+ years are incorrect, however the tropics are still navigated as if they are 2 bodies of equal distance.

Can you demonstrate the tropics are infact different sizes? (I think we both already know that answer.) Because if you can, then we can easily go through hundreds of years of captains logs, and point out "hey, they had to have double the supplies in order to travel this distance; and therfore we can demonstrate that they were lying!"

OK, concession noted.

That said, I have looked at these questions and the historical narrative from recorded journals from explorers like Cook, Clark and others reveal several problems with your idea that there are two approximately equal hemispheres. These journals show them constantly off their reckoning by miles, and the further "south" they would travel, the worse it would get. They were literally crashing into the southern tip of Africa when sailing at night. And these men are certainly some of the best to ever do it.

I mean when Cook tried to sail around Antarctica, he spent something like 3 years and 70,000 in his vain attempt. And in all that time he found no way to pass through that wall of ice?

Unfortunately, the reality of the situation is that IN REALITY, the tropics are equal in size. Unless you can prove that they aren't, which no flat earther has done in the last 6 years, despite their good intentions.

The sun moves faster on her journey towards our winter solstice which is why we observe 15 degrees of her arc per hour.

Questioning the rug I stand on, after I've pulled the rug out from under you, doesn't make your rug appear back under neath your feet any faster. However, questioning the quality of the rug you were standing on, is how you got started in "Flat" Earth to begin with. Have you bothered to question the size of the tropics? How they are navigated as equally sized bodies?

See above.

If so, why is it flat earthers can't demonstrate that in reality they are 2 different sizes? Is it because.... In reality, they aren't?

See above.

I also noticed you didn't even bother to discuss my point about the luminaries above us and their REQUIRED increase in acceleration/deceleration over the transit of "Flat Earth." Is this because, in reality we know it doesn't work that way? The Eye is only good for Appearance.

Look at any star trail and slow it down. The stars move faster the further away they are from Polaris. It's like a fan blade. And it's perfect. And our sidereal days are based on each one them returning to the position they maintained approximately 23 hours and 56 minutes previously. The fact that people attribute this AND ALSO our 24 hour solar days to the exact same thing, Earth's imagined axial rotation, is all you need to know.

Reality, is a physically navigable thing. Do you not find it odd that there is no phsycial navigational proof for "flat earth" other than airplane routes?

What are you saying? Have you looked at all the documented emergency landings and have you seen what happens when we lay them over the Gleason's map? But except for airplane routes? Are you kidding?

I have a little more time, so I'd like to touch on your silly meme.
--Continents out of proportion... please show us their true proportions.
--The supposed nonstop flights were just handled a page ago.
--17 hour southern solstice has to do with how light works and the difference between a light source like the sun and visible light.
--The position of the sun works perfectly on Gleason's map which is why it was patented as a time calculator.
--90-270 path?
--I just showed Polaris (still several degrees above the horizon) from almost 8 degrees south.
--I showed that there is no opposite spinning stars beyond the equator. I showed that it is perspective based on the observers direction.

Now, when you're done ignoring all that, and If both of those models are incorrect, what model, if I may ask, do you subscribe to?

 

[GandalfTheGreen]

OK, concession noted.

The apparent failure of "Flat" Earthers to demonstrate that their belief does not reflect reality is not a concession on my part, it's a flaw of their intentions. Impossible/Improbably questions will be answered by solutions of the same quality. The "Flat" earth's community cannot establish that it's belief, it's paradigm, it's mechanical; physical surface is what they claim it to be; no matter what form, simply because the form is flawed. I've already agreed that there's a reason why the maps "Flat" Earthers choose work for flight only. Hence, my statement "OTHER THAN FLIGHT" in my last reply. Do airplanes physically fly on the surface of the earth? If So, I'd like to see your pilots license and credentials, because I'm quite sure they fly over it, not on it.

"Cooks Voyage"

You mean the voyage of Captain James Cook? Who was sponsored by Edward Cornwallis? The Worshipful Master of the Freemasonic lodge at Halifax? (Which Cornwallis funded)

Are you aware that there have been people in modern times who have circumnavigated Antarctica, and were able to do it with much smaller vessels, and much less equipment, and much less funding than Cook's Masonic sponsored voyage?

"I mean when Cook tried to sail around Antarctica, he spent something like 3 years and 70,000 in his vain attempt. And in all that time he found no way to pass through that wall of ice?"

Well, when you use people who provide you half truth, with half lie as a source of complete truth, (Secret Societies) things tend to get complicated. Simplicity is the name of the game. In 2018 a ship christened by the name Katharis II 72 days to circumnavigate Antarctica below the 60th parallel. An amazing feet indeed! This crew was able to do it in 15x's the time! You would think, that if the maps below the 60'th parallel were created to scale to navigate the sea, that the crews using them would be able to circumnavigate Antarctica in an appropriate fashion. It appears that they do, in fact, work as they should!

Perhaps Captain Cook was using a AE projection, something that doesn't represent the mechanical, physical, on the surface of the earth navigation. Further more, why is it that he's the only person that took 3 years to circumnavigate Antarctica?

Clearly, the best people to ever circumnavigate Antarctica, are the people who were able to do it in 2018, in only 72 days. Not some voyage funded by the pillars of freemasonry.

Sailing Antarctica: Record-breaking voyage around the southern continent


"Now, when you're done ignoring all that, and If both of those models are incorrect, what model, if I may ask, do you subscribe to?"

The One that Works.

 

[otl2021]

OK, concession noted.

The apparent failure of "Flat" Earthers to demonstrate that their belief does not reflect reality is not a concession on my part, it's a flaw of their intentions. Impossible/Improbably questions will be answered by solutions of the same quality. The "Flat" earth's community cannot establish that it's belief, it's paradigm, it's mechanical; physical surface is what they claim it to be; no matter what form, simply because the form is flawed. I've already agreed that there's a reason why the maps "Flat" Earthers choose work for flight only. Hence, my statement "OTHER THAN FLIGHT" in my last reply. Do airplanes physically fly on the surface of the earth? If So, I'd like to see your pilots license and credentials, because I'm quite sure they fly over it, not on it.

"Cooks Voyage"

You mean the voyage of Captain James Cook? Who was sponsored by Edward Cornwallis? The Worshipful Master of the Freemasonic lodge at Halifax? (Which Cornwallis funded)

Are you aware that there have been people in modern times who have circumnavigated Antarctica, and were able to do it with much smaller vessels, and much less equipment, and much less funding than Cook's Masonic sponsored voyage?

"I mean when Cook tried to sail around Antarctica, he spent something like 3 years and 70,000 in his vain attempt. And in all that time he found no way to pass through that wall of ice?"

Well, when you use people who provide you half truth, with half lie as a source of complete truth, (Secret Societies) things tend to get complicated. Simplicity is the name of the game. In 2018 a ship christened by the name Katharis II 72 days to circumnavigate Antarctica below the 60th parallel. An amazing feet indeed! This crew was able to do it in 15x's the time! You would think, that if the maps below the 60'th parallel were created to scale to navigate the sea, that the crews using them would be able to circumnavigate Antarctica in an appropriate fashion. It appears that they do, in fact, work as they should!

Perhaps Captain Cook was using a AE projection, something that doesn't represent the mechanical, physical, on the surface of the earth navigation. Further more, why is it that he's the only person that took 3 years to circumnavigate Antarctica?

Clearly, the best people to ever circumnavigate Antarctica, are the people who were able to do it in 2018, in only 72 days. Not some voyage funded by the pillars of freemasonry.

Sailing Antarctica: Record-breaking voyage around the southern continent


"Now, when you're done ignoring all that, and If both of those models are incorrect, what model, if I may ask, do you subscribe to?"

The One that Works.

No, your concession was your inability to provide just one proof that the parallels above and below the equator of equal values are even close to the same distances.

Cook was certainly not the only explorer to note these things. And the masonic money behind him, whether real or imagined, does not necessarily change his journal entries.

No one has ever circumnavigated Antarctica, as no continent exists on the bottom of a ball. Freemason lies... all of them.

Which model works for you?

 

[Apollonius]

On the Flat Earth, the Sun does not rise for days even though it is 3 times closer to the city of Murmansk, while cities in New Zealand and Chile, which are somehow tens of thousands of kilometers away, experience about 16 hours of daylight.

Thus, we are putting the final nail in Flat Earth's coffin

 

[GandalfTheGreen]

--Continents out of proportion... please show us their true proportions. (Can't be done with your own map buddy, and I've made 0 claim that the heliocentric globe is accurate. Only that that physical navigation on the surface of earth, is different than navigation by air for a reason.
--The supposed nonstop flights were just handled a page ago.
--17 hour southern solstice has to do with how light works and the difference between a light source like the sun and visible light.
--The position of the sun works perfectly on Gleason's map which is why it was patented as a time calculator.
--90-270 path?
--I just showed Polaris (still several degrees above the horizon) from almost 8 degrees south.
--I showed that there is no opposite spinning stars beyond the equator. I showed that it is perspective based on the observers direction.

No, your concession was your inability to provide just one proof that the parallels above and below the equator of equal values are even close to the same distances.

Cook was certainly not the only explorer to note these things. And the masonic money behind him, whether real or imagined, does not necessarily change his journal entries.

No one has ever circumnavigated Antarctica, as no continent exists on the bottom of a ball. Freemason lies... all of them.

Which model works for you?

Just one? Sure. Open up your preferred navigation software, go to a place where you have two land masses on either side of the equator, that will be symmetrically opposite of each other along their respective latitudes. For the Example I will provide for you here, seeing as you said I only need ONE, I'll use the 120th Meridian East, And 30 degrees north of the equator, along with 30 degrees south of the equator. This will land you one point in China, with another point in Australia. Each point is an approximate 2100 miles from the equator. For the sake of simplicity for the cognitive ability of "Flat" earthers, I advice you use the points where the lat/long lines directly intersect each other because we'll be touching on the lines of convergence and divergence as we continue to grow this thread. The points that I used in this example should land you Near the Fuyang district in China, and near Mount Manning nature reserve in Australia.

The model that works, is the one that was introduced by Plato. It resurfaced again in the 1800's in another similar form, and again in the 1940's under the regime of Adolf Hitler. Endospheric Earth, Cellular Earth, "Con"cave Earth, Earth Id Est, I.E. : Inverse Earth. The reason why both heliocentrism, and flat earth, are an illusion. Occam's razor, which has always applied, points this out. And the more a person decides to dedicate time to the topic, the more they learn how foolish they were believing in "Flat" Earth.

It's not a coincidence that the worlds oldest form of navigation, science, and religion all have to do with the Celestial Sphere.

You want to stand by the archaic voyage of a man that took 3 years to circumnavigate a continent that was done in 2018 in 72 days.

"nobody" Set the world record, and they did it without nearly the funds/resources as the Cook voyage, which was infact funded by the freemasons.

 

[Jd755]

Could you supply a link to the 2018 voyage please?

 

[FarewellAngelina]

Polish yacht Katharsis II eyeing Hobart as Antarctic triumph nears end

Here's a link.

the map of the journey shows most of the journey outside of the arctic circle touching 70 degrees south four times before heading back out .

Not so impressive.

 

[Jd755]

Polish yacht Katharsis II eyeing Hobart as Antarctic triumph nears end

Here's a link.

the map of the journey shows most of the journey outside of the arctic circle touching 70 degrees south four times before heading back out .

Not so impressive.

Thank you. I found his website from your link. Strona główna Eng

 

[FarewellAngelina]

Thanks for that . Looking at the route map and the other data on that website it doesn't look like a Loop of Antarctica beneath 60 degrees at all. Why not circumnavigate the farkin continent?

It's not a coincidence that the worlds oldest form of navigation, science, and religion all have to do with the Celestial Sphere.

You want to stand by the archaic voyage of a man that took 3 years to circumnavigate a continent that was done in 2018 in 72 days.

That is not a circumnavigation of the continent , it's only close for about 30% of the time.

Also the celestial sphere is up in the sky - nothing to do with what's down here .

 

[Jd755]

Frankly the Polish chaps claim is as dodgy as Cooks journals to my eye. Cannot yet find anything about the lead up to this journey not even sponsors or companies taking credit for supply but they did manage to film themselves on the voyages.
The site is hosted and copyrighted, lapsed though it is, by a Polish media company.

Seems some other folks beat them to it by a good few years.

Since 1959 this family has cruised over 170,000 miles. Notable voyages include the first Antarctic circumnavigation, the first windward (east to west) circumnavigation south of all continents, and a circumnavigation via the canals

1972 Blue Water Medal to DR. ROBERT L., NANCY, & REID GRIFFITH aboard Awahnee | Cruising Club of America

 

[GandalfTheGreen]

Polish yacht Katharsis II eyeing Hobart as Antarctic triumph nears end

Here's a link.

the map of the journey shows most of the journey outside of the arctic circle touching 70 degrees south four times before heading back out .

Not so impressive.

Not so impressive except that it totally destroys the argument that it takes 3 years to circumnavigate Antarctica; when it was done quidem in 72 days. With a smaller vessel, and a smaller crew, less supplies, and less funding. The most important part about the entire thing is that it totally and utterly destroys your paradigm that demands that one tropic be larger than the other. This is why there is no working FE paradigm. It's against Intelligent Design in and of itself.

Frankly the Polish chaps claim is as dodgy as Cooks journals to my eye. Cannot yet find anything about the lead up to this journey not even sponsors or companies taking credit for supply but they did manage to film themselves on the voyages.
The site is hosted and copyrighted, lapsed though it is, by a Polish media company.

Seems some other folks beat them to it by a good few years.


1972 Blue Water Medal to DR. ROBERT L., NANCY, & REID GRIFFITH aboard Awahnee | Cruising Club of America

Using anecdotal logical fallacy to dismiss evidence does not mean that your opinion is more valid than anyone else trying to form their own their opinion. By "polish media company" you mean; documented in the "Guinness World Book of Records?"

 

[FarewellAngelina]

The whole thing about the Southern " hemisphere " is a myth . Anyone can check degrees of latitude in the North by simply measuring the degrees to the pole star. You can extrapolate on a line of longitude southwards using the zenith positions of rotating stars in relation to North star as far south as you need to find any degree of latitude . This has been known since ancient times and is the true scientific method for mapping the earth .

Giovanni Cassini mapped this way across France in the 17thC . He found degrees of latitude lengthened Southward. The equator is not at 0 degrees from the Pole star . Nick de laCaille ,mapping by the stars in the 18thC south of the equator found that his results supported those of Cassini .

The earths 23.4, or 66.6 degree tilt depending on which point you measure from , giving the 66.6 degree to both arctic and antarctic circles is just masonic/satanic crap. As pointed out by Eustace Mullins in that download I was reading -thanks Dreamtime.

This method of mapping will also remove the mythical refraction - refraction requires a physical boundary or surface of separation between two contacting substances to occur.

Light may bend in the atmosphere but will not refract - we don't know much about light.

 

[GandalfTheGreen]

Thanks for that . Looking at the route map and the other data on that website it doesn't look like a Loop of Antarctica beneath 60 degrees at all. Why not circumnavigate the farkin continent?

That is not a circumnavigation of the continent , it's only close for about 30% of the time.

Also the celestial sphere is up in the sky - nothing to do with what's down here .

Thanks for admitting there is a Celestial Sphere, we'll be touching that here in a moment as well. As far as "close" that isn't what is clearly demonstrated. What is clearly demonstrated is that the Katharis II performed physical, mechanical navigation over the surface of the earth by boat, entirely, and utterly destroys the 1772 voyage of James cook.

Back to the Celestial Sphere. This is the reason that the polar stars spin opposite of eachother. You might be familiar with the term Atlas? It has been popularized phonetically to be a book of maps used to travel. A "Road Atlas."

Some may be familiar that he carried something upon his back? Something called a "Celestial Sphere." Something the Ancients have been using for navigation, worship, and science for thousands of years. Something being plainly hidden from you in plain sight to this day.

The whole thing about the Southern " hemisphere " is a myth . Anyone can check degrees of latitude in the North by simply measuring the degrees to the pole star. You can extrapolate on a line of longitude southwards using the zenith positions of rotating stars in relation to North star as far south as you need to find any degree of latitude . This has been known since ancient times and is the true scientific method for mapping the earth .

Giovanni Cassini mapped this way across France in the 17thC . He found degrees of latitude lengthened Southward. The equator is not at 0 degrees from the Pole star . Nick de laCaille ,mapping by the stars in the 18thC south of the equator found that his results supported those of Cassini .

The earths 23.4, or 66.6 degree tilt depending on which point you measure from , giving the 66.6 degree to both arctic and antarctic circles is just masonic/satanic crap. As pointed out by Eustace Mullins in that download I was reading -thanks Dreamtime.

This method of mapping will also remove the mythical refraction - refraction requires a physical boundary or surface of separation between two contacting substances to occur.

Light may bend in the atmosphere but will not refract - we don't know much about light.

"Flat" Earthers lack knowledge of Light, but Water as well. Something I'm sure we'll touch on as we discuss the Celestial Sphere now that it has finally come into Focus.


"The earths 23.4, or 66.6 degree tilt depending on which point you measure from , giving the 66.6 degree to both arctic and antarctic circles is just masonic/satanic crap."

Yet.... You stand by a voyage from the 1700's funded by freemasons, over people who did it during a modern day and age and much less funding.

None the less... No flat earther has ever demonstrated that the tropic of Capricorn is in fact what it would have to be for their paradigm to work. Nor have they ever attempted to do such a thing.


Perhaps you can extrapolate to me how Cassini's mapping of France, (A country roughly 4,000KM wide) is some how relevant, or more superior to either Cook's voyage, (Of 3 years, and a claimed 70,000 antarctic circumference) or the Katharis II's voyage?

And let me get this straight, you admit that a Celestial Sphere is required for the Navigation of earth by sea, yet you claim there is no such thing as the southern hemisphere?

As per the usual, the truth of the nature of the problem, is right in front of your face, and you refuse to see it. The whole gig is hiding intelligent design. "Flat" Earth is far from intelligent design.

 

[El Forastero]

I'm still waiting on the "Flat Earthers" to demonstrate that the physical, mechanical navigation techniques used for the last... 500+ years are incorrect, however the tropics are still navigated as if they are 2 bodies of equal distance.

Reality, is a physically navigable thing. Do you not find it odd that there is no phsycial navigational proof for "flat earth" other than airplane routes? Do you not find it odd that literally, the only form of navigation to work with the AE projection is Flight? Occam's razor always applies. There is a reason the apparent horizon is always rising to eye level. Flat things don't rise physically or mechanically.

How can the Earth be navigated at all if not for a flat, stationary, plane beneath our feet?

Euclidean geometry proves the reality. You cannot use trigonometry with a curved adjacent.

There is no proof of a physical curve and the radius will NEVER be measured, because it is a figment of the imagination.