Flat Earth

[Deleted member 1432]

I abandoned the Flat Earth debate years ago precisely because of the pointless fragmentation caused by the firmament and dome movement, which was obviously a deliberate ploy and a successful one as it appealed to the biblical folks. Still today there is no real proof of either a firmament or a dome or at least none that has ever convinced me personally.

The business of seeing a curved horizon is also the FE movement's Achilles Heel, imo. If you were a fly who was unfortunate enough to find itself on the top of a hot air balloon, your horizon would look perfectly flat throughout it's 360 degree view around the balloon's circumference or local horizon. How could it be otherwise? How could there be any curves, lumps or bumps in one part of it and not the other? In my view, lack of curvature on the horizon is not proof of anything.

Far more important is that when the fly gets up to any considerable altitude on the hot air balloon ride, he will find that when he looks beyond the circumference of the balloon to the true horizon he will see it's also flat, but he will see it at eye level all the way up. If he then takes off and flies even higher above the balloon he will lose sight of it as it drops away beneath him, but the actual horizon will still be at eye level no matter how high he goes. (As per non-photoshopped images from the Red Bull balloon parachute jump.)

Eye Level Horizon​

 

[Lightseeker]

I abandoned the Flat Earth debate years ago precisely because of the pointless fragmentation caused by the firmament and dome movement, which was obviously a deliberate ploy and a successful one as it appealed to the biblical folks. Still today there is no real proof of either a firmament or a dome or at least none that has ever convinced me personally.

The business of seeing a curved horizon is also the FE movement's Achilles Heel, imo. If you were a fly who was unfortunate enough to find itself on the top of a hot air balloon, your horizon would look perfectly flat throughout it's 360 degree view around the balloon's circumference or local horizon. How could it be otherwise? How could there be any curves, lumps or bumps in one part of it and not the other? In my view, lack of curvature on the horizon is not proof of anything.

Far more important is that when the fly gets up to any considerable altitude on the hot air balloon ride, he will find that when he looks beyond the circumference of the balloon to the true horizon he will see it's also flat, but he will see it at eye level all the way up. If he then takes off and flies even higher above the balloon he will lose sight of it as it drops away beneath him, but the actual horizon will still be at eye level no matter how high he goes. (As per non-photoshopped images from the Red Bull balloon parachute jump.)

View attachment 8391​

Eye Level Horizon​

Gee that is one small Earth!

 

[grav]

Video's not needed frankly. Trust ones own experience and intuition instead.
This workboats and its aerial are not taller than Blackpool tower it just appears to be.
Blackpool tower is not leaning backwards away from the camera even though it should be according to some.
The water is not rising up from foreground to background even though it appears to be.
Blackpool is not sinking into the water even though it appears to be.
Horizon is dead level just as it always is.

View attachment 8308​

Great interview out yesterday on various FE topics led by Shawn at SGT Report and his guests, David Weiss and Matt Long.
David was on screen all the time and had some great photos and videos explaining what he was talking about. The guy has really connected some dots for me. Holy cow!

This is one example below. He goes through the timeline of the physical discoveries about the nature of our flat world and firmament, and the efforts to hide what they discovered. Go to 58 minutes if you want to jump in there.


Operation High Jump 1946..............Discovery of the ice wall

Operation Deep Freeze 1955...........Discovery of the Firmament

Nasa Founded 1958........................The Firmament is the Van Allen belts

Antarctic Treaty 1959......................Guarding the Firmament

Operation Fishbowl 1962...............Bombing the Firmament

Apollo Mission 1969.......................Hoax to Hide the Firmament



View: https://www.bitchute.com/video/OULEg75g6DSw/

Excellent post. I will copy pasta on Banned.Talk and FEFriends.
As I said earlier, I prefer text to videos. You provided both. I will watch this one.
Critics will say there is no proof of those discoveries. As if we can break into top secret headquarters and steal their documents.
So-called Atom bomb tests were conducted by the hundreds back in the 50s and 60s. First, there is no atom to split in the Electric Universe. Nagasaki and Hiroshima were firebombed with conventional explosives. Primarily truckloads of TNT.

The true purpose of those explosions were, as you have noted, to map the height and shape of the firmament.
Wehrner Von Braun made that clear on his tombstone: Psalms 19:1. "The heavens are telling the glory of God and the firmament proclaims his handiwork.”

 

[Lightseeker]

Video's not needed frankly. Trust ones own experience and intuition instead.
This workboats and its aerial are not taller than Blackpool tower it just appears to be.
Blackpool tower is not leaning backwards away from the camera even though it should be according to some.
The water is not rising up from foreground to background even though it appears to be.
Blackpool is not sinking into the water even though it appears to be.
Horizon is dead level just as it always is.

View attachment 8308​

Great interview out yesterday on various FE topics led by Shawn at SGT Report and his guests, David Weiss and Matt Long.
David was on screen all the time and had some great photos and videos explaining what he was talking about. The guy has really connected some dots for me. Holy cow!

This is one example below. He goes through the timeline of the physical discoveries about the nature of our flat world and firmament, and the efforts to hide what they discovered. Go to 58 minutes if you want to jump in there.


Operation High Jump 1946..............Discovery of the ice wall

Operation Deep Freeze 1955...........Discovery of the Firmament

Nasa Founded 1958........................The Firmament is the Van Allen belts

Antarctic Treaty 1959......................Guarding the Firmament

Operation Fishbowl 1962...............Bombing the Firmament

Apollo Mission 1969.......................Hoax to Hide the Firmament



View: https://www.bitchute.com/video/OULEg75g6DSw/

Excellent post. I will copy pasta on Banned.Talk and FEFriends.
As I said earlier, I prefer text to videos. You provided both. I will watch this one.
Critics will say there is no proof of those discoveries. As if we can break into top secret headquarters and steal their documents.
So-called Atom bomb tests were conducted by the hundreds back in the 50s and 60s. First, there is no atom to split in the Electric Universe. Nagasaki and Hiroshima were firebombed with conventional explosives. Primarily truckloads of TNT.

The true purpose of those explosions were, as you have noted, to map the height and shape of the firmament.
Wehrner Von Braun made that clear on his tombstone: Psalms 19:1. "The heavens are telling the glory of God and the firmament proclaims his handiwork.”

Care to provide any reading material that substantiates this statement?

 

[Starman]

I like this night time video clip of what appears to be a rocket skipping along and plowing into the curved firmament like some speed boat leaving a wake behind. It really has the look of water or some kind of evanescent fluid that the rocket is pushing into.

I've seen this imagery before on mainstream media.

Starts at 35:27


View: https://www.bitchute.com/video/7d03557ycOJe/

 

[Jd755]

The firmament a frame of reference?
What are the definitions of the word firmament?
Which one is being used to describe something 'in the sky'?
How does gaining evidence of its existence prove the shape of the thing we walk on?
Who would test the lid of a container by exploding a bomb underneath it?
Who would do that test on a firmament having no idea what is beyond the lid?
Why is it the United States government the thing that did these 'tests'?
If the firmament is really in place as the tests 'proved its existence' and its seemingly indestructible nature and it is big secret then why are talking heads allowed to talk about in on the devils platform youtube repeatedly and at length.?

You and I see a domed starry sky as a result of our eyes geometry. It's weird people who seem to accept the sun and moon do not rise up or sink below an horizon see a domed shape starry sky with the exact same apparatus, their eyes, and their singular geometry. People who accept water does not actually rise up to meet the sky at the vanishing point see a dome over their head. Maybe just me but I find it quite funny these days.

Edit to add "the thing that"

 

[grav]

a deliberate ploy and a successful one as it appealed to the biblical folks. Still today there is no real proof of either a firmament or a dome or at least none that has ever convinced me personally.

The business of seeing a curved horizon is also the FE movement's Achilles Heel, imo. If you were a fly who was unfortunate enough to find itself on the top of a hot air balloon, your horizon would

1. Firmament
Did you read my summary points above? one of which asked how air pressure is maintained without a container? Atmosperic gases require a specified volume in order to resist the vacuum of space at the Karman line. 62 miles. As an atheist, I interpret the Bible as a hodgepodge of Jesuit/freemason truth-telling and BS-ing.

2. The horizon
rises to the eye of the observer. If earth were a finite globe, it would diminish in size as altitude increases. The opposite happens, as the horizon expands to take in a larger view of the Infinite Plane. The Red Bull (haha more bull clues) jump by Felix Baumgardner shows a curvy horizon thanks to a fish-eye lens. Pics made with a lens correction show a flat horizon.

 

[Worsaae]

a deliberate ploy and a successful one as it appealed to the biblical folks. Still today there is no real proof of either a firmament or a dome or at least none that has ever convinced me personally.

The business of seeing a curved horizon is also the FE movement's Achilles Heel, imo. If you were a fly who was unfortunate enough to find itself on the top of a hot air balloon, your horizon would

1. Firmament
Did you read my summary points above? one of which asked how air pressure is maintained without a container? Atmosperic gases require a specified volume in order to resist the vacuum of space at the Karman line. 62 miles. As an atheist, I interpret the Bible as a hodgepodge of Jesuit/freemason truth-telling and BS-ing.

2. The horizon
rises to the eye of the observer. If earth were a finite globe, it would diminish in size as altitude increases. The opposite happens, as the horizon expands to take in a larger view of the Infinite Plane. The Red Bull (haha more bull clues) jump by Felix Baumgardner shows a curvy horizon thanks to a fish-eye lens. Pics made with a lens correction show a flat horizon.

How far away is the horizon?

 

[grav]

a deliberate ploy and a successful one as it appealed to the biblical folks. Still today there is no real proof of either a firmament or a dome or at least none that has ever convinced me personally.

The business of seeing a curved horizon is also the FE movement's Achilles Heel, imo. If you were a fly who was unfortunate enough to find itself on the top of a hot air balloon, your horizon would

1. Firmament
Did you read my summary points above? one of which asked how air pressure is maintained without a container? Atmosperic gases require a specified volume in order to resist the vacuum of space at the Karman line. 62 miles. As an atheist, I interpret the Bible as a hodgepodge of Jesuit/freemason truth-telling and BS-ing.

2. The horizon
rises to the eye of the observer. If earth were a finite globe, it would diminish in size as altitude increases. The opposite happens, as the horizon expands to take in a larger view of the Infinite Plane. The Red Bull (haha more bull clues) jump by Felix Baumgardner shows a curvy horizon thanks to a fish-eye lens. Pics made with a lens correction show a flat horizon.

How far away is the horizon?

That depends. Human vision is limited to around 3 miles.
Zoom lenses can extend visibility to much greater distances.

The horizon is an optical illusion. It's where all lines of convergence meet at the vanishing point.

 

[Jd755]

Human vision is limited to around 3 miles.

If you don't mind me asking how did you establish this?

 

[grav]

Human vision is limited to around 3 miles.

If you don't mind me asking how did you establish this?

Multiple sites, including this one,
When I stand at the water's edge and look out over the ocean, how far away is the horizon?.

 

[Citezenship]

https://babylonbee.com/news/nasa-frantically-building-real-moon-for-elon-to-land-on/This one cracks me up!


View: https://www.bitchute.com/video/RUe04ct1QEsx/

 

[David Glenney]

That doesn't seem a very credible source, grav. Ha! But really, they are claiming the horizon is further or lower the higher you are. I mean, it would be if one resided on a globe.

I found this piece pretty interesting. He does some practical-scale experiments with perspective. Good visual aids--perspective lines, graphs:

A Concept for Vision Appendix A: Bottom First Disappearance Across Flat Surfaces

And mega brings up a good point. If I was skeptical of my high school history book, but thought my science book was totally legit (though the same indoctrination officials selected both), then I may not have been skeptical enough. But there's no Torah in the school--though I've heard of Holocaust Studies. No I Ching. Certainly no Flat Earth, German New Medicine, Tesla, anything supernatural and absolutely no Stolen History. It's the Church of the Official Narrative...

Innerspace, Outerspace, History--the Unseen. This is the easiest stuff for them to lie about.

 

[Jd755]

Grav apologies poor wording on my part. What did you do to establish this limit with your own efforts. Not sure that's any clearer. Did you test the web page answers in the real world?

Edit to add
From the linked site. Dearie me.

One of the funniest things about the ocean is the fact that its surface is curved. We tend to think about water forming large flat sheets, but the surface of a large body of water is not actually flat at all -- it follows the curvature of the Earth.

 

[grav]

Distance to horizon.
No, I did not go to the seashore with a Google map app in order to measure an optical illusion.
What is up with all this hoopla about our ability to see the vanishing point?
This is a matter of perspective and ALL analyses of it come up with a ballpark number of 3 miles for a person 6 foot or under. And? So what?

A more important question is this -- with zoom lenses can we see actual targets beyond what globe math says we should? Yes. All Chicago skyscrapers should be hidden by the curve at 50 miles across Lake Michigan. The horizon itself is a blurry line that has nothing to do with observation of physical objects.

Instead of haranguing me for my own calculations of the horizon, I recommend a web search of perspective and optics of human eyesight.

 

[Jd755]

Thank you for your honest reply.
It's obvious to me from a lot of real world situations of using my eyes to establish the likely distance of mountains, most often but other things on occasion, on 'the horizon' in relation to where I am stood or more often sat it differs. I then of course have to look up the stated distance in books/internet/charts. How far I can see depends on the state of the weather between me and whatever I am looking at so I know its a movable feast not a specific distance that we cannot see beyond. The furthest I have been able to see a mountain has been 73 miles from my position.
I can easily see an island 54 miles away from me stood on the sea shore most days unless the weather obscures it.
It was just the assertion that the horizon distance was limited to just 3 miles that prompted the question you found so irksome which was asked as you might have found a limit I had not.

Edit to add "it differs"

 

[Deleted member 1432]

a deliberate ploy and a successful one as it appealed to the biblical folks. Still today there is no real proof of either a firmament or a dome or at least none that has ever convinced me personally.

The business of seeing a curved horizon is also the FE movement's Achilles Heel, imo. If you were a fly who was unfortunate enough to find itself on the top of a hot air balloon, your horizon would

1. Firmament
Did you read my summary points above? one of which asked how air pressure is maintained without a container? Atmosperic gases require a specified volume in order to resist the vacuum of space at the Karman line. 62 miles. As an atheist, I interpret the Bible as a hodgepodge of Jesuit/freemason truth-telling and BS-ing.

2. The horizon
rises to the eye of the observer. If earth were a finite globe, it would diminish in size as altitude increases. The opposite happens, as the horizon expands to take in a larger view of the Infinite Plane. The Red Bull (haha more bull clues) jump by Felix Baumgardner shows a curvy horizon thanks to a fish-eye lens. Pics made with a lens correction show a flat horizon.

I think maybe one of us has missed the point. Probably my fault I expect. There's no disagreement here as far as I can tell.

I've just remembered why I don't get involved in FE discussions anymore, so I won't.

 

[grav]

Thank you for your honest reply.
It's obvious to me from a lot of real world situations of using my eyes to establish the likely distance of mountains, most often but other things on occasion, on 'the horizon' in relation to where I am stood or more often sat it differs. I then of course have to look up the stated distance in books/internet/charts. How far I can see depends on the state of the weather between me and whatever I am looking at so I know its a movable feast not a specific distance that we cannot see beyond. The furthest I have been able to see a mountain has been 73 miles from my position.
I can easily see an island 54 miles away from me stood on the sea shore most days unless the weather obscures it.
It was just the assertion that the horizon distance was limited to just 3 miles that prompted the question you found so irksome which was asked as you might have found a limit I had not.

Edit to add "it differs"

You still do not get the distinction.

Yes, you can see targets that have nothing to do with the horizon.
A simple search for "the vanishing point" would clear up your misunderstanding of this optical illusion. Have you?

a deliberate ploy and a successful one as it appealed to the biblical folks. Still today there is no real proof of either a firmament or a dome or at least none that has ever convinced me personally.

The business of seeing a curved horizon is also the FE movement's Achilles Heel, imo. If you were a fly who was unfortunate enough to find itself on the top of a hot air balloon, your horizon would

1. Firmament
Did you read my summary points above? one of which asked how air pressure is maintained without a container? Atmosperic gases require a specified volume in order to resist the vacuum of space at the Karman line. 62 miles. As an atheist, I interpret the Bible as a hodgepodge of Jesuit/freemason truth-telling and BS-ing.

2. The horizon
rises to the eye of the observer. If earth were a finite globe, it would diminish in size as altitude increases. The opposite happens, as the horizon expands to take in a larger view of the Infinite Plane. The Red Bull (haha more bull clues) jump by Felix Baumgardner shows a curvy horizon thanks to a fish-eye lens. Pics made with a lens correction show a flat horizon.

I think maybe one of us has missed the point. Probably my fault I expect. There's no disagreement here as far as I can tell.

I've just remembered why I don't get involved in FE discussions anymore, so I won't.

Yep, a motionless plane is not easy for some people to grasp.
A spinning sphere moving many machs in multiple motions is much easier to believe in.
If I have misunderstood your previous point, I regret the confusion.
But I never regret my alliteration.

 

[Jd755]

Have you?

Have I what?
Oh I get it. You want me to go and get other peoples take on what a vanishing point is. I know what it is and what creates it and know it doesn't really exist other than in my eyes and brain's optical geometry.
Sheesh all this because someone, worsae I think, asked a question."How far away is the horizon?" and then I had the temerity to ask you a question as you stated "Human vision is limited to 3 miles".
Human vision does not have a 3 mile limit it has a varying limit.
If you look at the photo of the boat in front of Blackpool tower that tower is about 8 miles as the crow flies from the camera's position. The tower is beyond the horizon line created by the water appearing to rise up in our vision.

Edit to remove a surplus 'asked'

 

[Starman]

Tomorrow:


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s8qwZhYQfb8