St George's Hall, Liverpool.

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Timeshifter
SH.org OP Date
2019-11-01 12:35:37
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101
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Username: Beedubya
Date: 2019-11-08 07:57:28
Reaction Score: 1
My reply:

Thank you for your e mail

Unfortunately there would be no photographs – as construction started on the hall in 1841 and it opened in 1854 – so well before photography really came in to its own . Obviously we would have architects drawings / plans – but that’s not what you really want . We do have a collection of documents which may be of interest – described as correspondence etc of Robert Rawlinson – relating to St Georges Hall ( 920 RAW ) . I can’t say for certain – but there may be some sketches included in these . I have attached the index to the collection for your perusal – in case there may be anything you are interested in viewing . If you want to see anything from the collection – you will need to make an appointment with us – giving at least 2 working day’s notice . Just e mail us back with a preferred date/time for your booking and your item list ( limited to 10 per visit ) with full item references – and we will do our best to accommodate you . Other than that I can only suggest contacting St George’s hall – to see if they can advise – see link below :-


Home: St George's Hall, Liverpool - Conference and Events Venue

I hope you find this information useful

Best wishes Karen

I can't seem to attach the download. ?
 
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Username: Timeshifter
Date: 2019-11-08 08:01:08
Reaction Score: 2
It's a theory. Nothing is reset as in taken back to zero. No ones minds are reset. I see it as more somekind of coming together of realities. Some kind of cataclism where some survive some don't. During which, bits of one reality end up in another, hence all of those 'neoclassical' buildings that look out of place, the tech we cant figure out, undetgrounds etc, stories that don't make sense are so because they did not originate it our reality.

To explain this to the regular folk, history is fabricated, and memories are short, especially in desperate times.

Something like that.
 
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Username: jd755
Date: 2019-11-08 08:04:03
Reaction Score: 1
Thanks. I get where you are coming from. Brought to mind the ending of the Lion the witch and the wardrobe series where Aslan closed one reality down and opened another.
 
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Username: Timeshifter
Date: 2019-11-08 08:04:13
Reaction Score: 1
Unfortumately, we know.there should be photos. That is a pretty standard and expected response.

Perhaps there are mega details in newspapers, journals, letters etc...? Have you managed to read the attachment?

Ty for doing what you can :)
 
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Username: Beedubya
Date: 2019-11-08 08:07:00
Reaction Score: 1
This is what's in the attachment:

Liverpool Record Office

920 RAW: CORRESPONDENCE OF ROBERT RAWLINSON RELATING TO ST. GEORGE'S HALL


In the printed version of the correspondence, there appears a letter, dated 27 September, 1841, from H. L. Elmes to Rawlinson, which does not form part of the collection of MS. letters presented by Rawlinson to the Library. Letters of 15 November 1841, 12 May 1842, 12 October 1842 and 7 January 1843, which do form part of this collection, do not appear in the printed version. MS. transcripts of the letter were prepared in the Library during the nineteenth century. 1841-1863.124 documents. Robert Rawlinson, Assistant Surveyor to Liverpool Corporation, 1840-43, assisted Harvey Lonsdale Elmes in the construction of St. Goerge's Hall. Harvey Lonsdale Elmes was born near Chichester on 10 February, 1814, the son of James Elmes, architect and author of several works on architecture. In 1836, a fund was opened in Liverpool for the construction of a concert hall for large scale performances and a foundation stone was laid in 1838. Nothing further was done, however, until in March 1839, a competition for the design of a hall was announced. Harvey Lonsdale Elmes entered and his was the winning design amongst 75 entries. In 1840, the Corporation decided to build new Assize Courts and a second competition was held. Elmes' design was again chosen, from 86 entries. It was then suggested that the two buildings be combined and the Corporation finance the construction of one large block. The City Architect, Franklin, was commissioned to prepare a design but Elmes claimed the right to revise his designs and Franklin generously gave him his plans to facilitate this. Elmes' revised designs were accepted and building work began in 1842. Elmes worked long hours to achieve perfection but ill-health made frequent journeys from his London office to Liverpool impossible. Robert Rawlinson, Assistant Surveyor to Liverpool Corporation, 1840-1843, helped Elmes by supervising construction work on the spot and his interest continued, ever after Rawlinson became engineer to the Bridgewater Trust in 1843. The two were thus in correspondence. By 1847, Elmes' health had so deteriorated that he was advised to go to the West Indies, where he died on 27 November, 1847, aged 33. However, Elmes had left drawing detailing his intentions for the Hall and work continued for four years under the general supervision of Rawlinson, to whom Elmes' plans and papers had been left. The final work of decoration, sculpture, etc., was completed by C. R. Cockerell, appointed to the task on Rawlinson's recommendation. The building was opened in 1854. In later years, Sir Robert Rawlinson was accused by some of having assumed too much responsibility for the building of the Hall. By way of defence against these charges, he published his correspondence with Elmes and others, privately, in 1871, under the title: Correspondence relative to St. George's Hall [Ref: H 942.7213 GEO]Access will be granted to any accredited reader For further information on Elmes, the architectural features of St. Georges Hall and the work of C. R. Cockerell, SEE: Ronald P. Jones: Life and Work of Harvey Lonsdale Elmes, in Architectural Review, v. 15, June 1904, and R. P. Cockerell: Life and Work of C. R. Cockerell: op. cit., v. 12, August and October 1902 [REF. Hq 920 COC]. For further records relating to St. George's Hall, SEE 900 MD 19-21.
I must have walked past St George's Hall hundreds of times and had no real interest until I started reading about the Tartarian buildings. It's just, until now, been a part of my landscape since childhood, I've obviously always acknowledged it's a beautiful building but that was about it.
 
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Username: Timeshifter
Date: 2019-11-08 08:23:24
Reaction Score: 1
Wow, thats pretty embarrassing if that is all the library has! Or is it all they are allowed to share, Karen probably doesn't know any truths.

Looks like we will have to hit the streets/ relatives/ friends/ great grandparents to see if anything exists.

Thanks again!
 
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Username: Timeshifter
Date: 2019-11-08 08:55:11
Reaction Score: 1
This lines up with Maps of the same time, which incidentally, 3 or 4 of which have turned up online, in the same places I have looked at maps for the last year, they were not there until when I have looked the last few days!

Ackerman's 1847 panoramic, but tbh this could have been drawn anytime

ackermans.JPG

Good job I am not paranoid....

This image JD posted a few pages back, is the only one anywhere online I can see that claims this building to be under construction.

gfHZYXx.jpg
This building is old, weathered, dirty, not new, imo.

A slight aside, but another building of interest in Liverpool is the 5th Customs House, on the old docks. Complete 1839, demolished 1948 after being slightly damaged in the blitz. Where have we heard that before. Even less info and images on this one, considering it survived for so long. (I will start a new thread)

customs house.jpg
 
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Username: Beedubya
Date: 2019-11-08 09:02:52
Reaction Score: 1
So it should be gleaming if new right? ?
 
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Username: KorbenDallas
Date: 2019-11-08 09:08:45
Reaction Score: 1
New building, new thread please.
 
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Username: jd755
Date: 2019-11-08 11:41:26
Reaction Score: 1
A few more snippets and sources this time courtesy of gibiru and the search string; made the bronze doors for St George's hall Liverpool.

From here; Statues in Liverpool - Page 6 - SkyscraperCity
One thing i've noticed photographing some of the sculpture and architectural detail around the city centre is the different types of stone. Some stone, which appears to be sandstone is remarkably good condition considering some,like St George's Hall are over 150 years old. The reliefs on the Lyceum, are still crisp, as is the carving on the frieze of the town hall, both these buildings are over 200 years old. I know St George's Hall and i think most of the William Brown St group are made of Darley Dale stone,better known as Stancliffe stone. It is a type of sandstone but much tougher than our local sandstone, which is a type of stone called New Red sandstone,it extends well in to cheshire and as far north as cumbria. Our local sandstone weathers and erodes badly, the estimate is 100 years exposure to the elements before noticeable erosion starts.

From here; St George's Hall
At the south entrance of the building will be a large and massive pair of bronze doors, 21ft high and 11ft wide, they are of rich design, and weigh about 7tons. Each leaf weighs in itself about 2 and a half tons, and works very freely, but as the labour of opening and shutting these doors frequently would be very great, there will be a wicket on one of them. These are the largest metal doors in England.

From here; St. George's Hall, Liverpool - Conservation and new-build projects - Calibre Metalwork
St. George's Hall, Liverpool

These bronze doors into the basement of St. George’s Hall, Liverpool look relatively insignificant in scale with the building, but they are nearly twelve feet high! In regular use as a visitor entrance, the doors had become difficult for staff to operate. Our survey identified that wear in the hinges had allowed the doors to sag. The problem was solved by repairs and modifications to the hinge units and we are continuing to service and monitor them.


From here; The South Front of St George's Hall, Liverpool on JSTOR

From Flickr a lovely comparison of the colour and the black and white versions of the sandstone. click the right hand arrow to see the b&w photo.

St. George's Hall, Liverpool
 
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Username: Timeshifter
Date: 2019-11-08 12:25:15
Reaction Score: 3
'These bronze doors into the basement of St. George’s Hall, Liverpool look relatively insignificant in scale with the building, but they are nearly twelve feet high! In regular use as a visitor entrance, the doors had become difficult for staff to operate.'

A 12 foot door for a 5" 6' average person, they will get difficult.

Who would build a 12 foot door for regular use by a 5" 6' person?


My guess, the door was made for someone strong, and closer to 10ft in height.

_DSC0811 c sm.jpg

Discovered some great interior shots here Interior
 
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Username: Beedubya
Date: 2019-11-08 12:33:30
Reaction Score: 1
The average height would have been less then. How would a person have the strength to open those huge heavy doors?

I still live quite near and am happy to take photos if required for clarification
 
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Username: jd755
Date: 2019-11-08 12:48:15
Reaction Score: 0
Those doors you have put white boxes around admitted horsedrawn prison vans into the basement and its holding cells according to the newspaper article transcript.
 
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Username: Timeshifter
Date: 2019-11-08 13:00:05
Reaction Score: 1
Possible, this is what meets you as you enter the one top of the hill on the right

Left view

_DSC0813 c.jpg

Right View

_DSC0814.JPG

And looking back towards the entrance...

_DSC0882.jpg

And looking forward as you come through those two columns

_DSC0884.jpg
I am no expert, but dropping cons off with horse and carriage? :unsure:
 
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Username: jd755
Date: 2019-11-08 13:19:21
Reaction Score: 2
Yeah at second look that door looks more like an entrance and exit to and from the court. The article is probably referring to the pair on the left whereas the door repairers are referring to the ones you went through.
Here's the cell side innards ; The secrets of St George's Hall, Liverpool. Pictures Colin Lane

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Username: Starmonkey
Date: 2019-11-08 13:53:09
Reaction Score: 1
No, BUT I've pulled from several sources that if the EM of the earth drops, LOTS of things happen. So, in low flux or pole switch, we ALSO lose our memories and our minds. The background frequency which holds it all together having dropped off. More "together" individuals have a better chance of coming through. MAYBE there's healings or therapies for it, but i haven't heard about them.
 
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Username: wild heretic
Date: 2019-11-08 14:09:13
Reaction Score: 3

My guess is that its a relic from "Roman" times. Of course, I've no idea when that really was. Later middle ages? Renaissance? 1700s? The building existed in between one of the earth changing epochs that changed Britain I suppose. But only speculations of course.
 
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Username: Beedubya
Date: 2019-11-10 15:09:39
Reaction Score: 1
Some photos taken in November 2015

FB_IMG_1573398051756.jpgFB_IMG_1573398025194.jpg
FB_IMG_1573398041996.jpgFB_IMG_1573398034408.jpg
 
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