SH Archive Tartarian Language and Alphabet

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Jim Duyer

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Username: Jim Duyer
Date: 2019-06-20 15:35:22
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"Other academics believe Korean is part of the “Altaic” language family, a family that includes Finno-Urgric, and Hungarian, languages mentioned here as likely coming from or (Most likely) being related to Tartarian"
This I believe to be very true.


"As well as Turkish, Manchu and Mongolian and even Japanese." I can buy the Mongolian to some extent, but not the Turkish or Japanese or Manchu. Japanese was influenced by both the Chinese and the indigenous peoples of the islands of Japan - especially those of Hokkaido. Turkish has long been connected to the Iranian and *stan languages. Manchu represents the leaders of perhaps yet another connection or assignment with the earliest Chinese peoples.

Another thing to consider is that the mid-coastal region of Korea has the most intelligent people in the world. Literally, their IQ is as high as Singapore or other peoples. So perhaps they are indeed connected somehow to the eastern branch of Tartaria.
 

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Username: Curiousguy
Date: 2019-06-20 16:50:40
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Well, Not Japanese itself actually, rather Proto-Japonic, the common ancestor of Japanese and Ryukyuan (that's as far back as they've traced). And And even if Japan has been influenced , influence doesn't stop a language from showing it's roots, just because English was Latinized due to the invasion of Saxony (now Britain, taking the name from Norman Brittany) by Normandy doesn't mean it no longer has anything in common with it's cousins.

English: Garden. Kid. Speak. Horizon. The.

German: Garten. Kinder. Sprecan. Horizont. Die.

(and of course same lexical structure, not like Latin's which seems backward to us.)

There's just enough shared linguistic DNA there to see these two are brothers as part of the Germanic Language family even when you can't understand a word of 99 Luftballons. (Well you can probably make out what the title means "Lift/Luft" "Ballon/Balloon" it means Balloon, they float due to helium, y'know. So the song is something about 99 Balloons. )

Anyways back to Japanese, Japanese has a similar lexical structure with Korean an Altaic Language (even before Japanese occupation which didn't do much more than add a few words. Not enough time. ) and to the other Altaic languages as well, also interesting that you bring up Hokkaido, because the Ainu language is also considered Altaic from the Finno-Ugric branch, evidence suggests the Ainu peoples came from the Ural mountains.

The Finnish-Japanese connection - Yamagata Europe


Again it's much more likely that these languages are related to Tartarian rather than coming from it (not enough time for a split considering Tartary is mentioned in 1810s), and that Greater Tartary is some sort of ethnic union of peoples with a shared background. Again similar to the origin of German Confederation (today, Germany) from the Alemanni German tribes.

And it isn't at all unheard for an empire to try to "bring home" and unite peoples it shares origins with but are outside it's borders. Even Nazi Germany was Pan-German wanting "fellow Aryans", Germanic Peoples, to be within it's borders the "Greater German Reich" they also invaded Czechoslovakia because of it's German minority population. Hell Putin of Russia right now wants to annex the former Soviet Bloc to bring "Soviet citizens" "back home", that's why he's Annexing Ukraine.

So it's totally possible Tartary was a nationalist Pan-Altaic (Pan-Tartar?) state. I'm sure that fervor was what lead to the empire spreading beyond the Altaic lands.

The Turkic language family is Altaic, it is not Indo-Iranian.

Manchu is not connected to the Sino-Tibetan languages such as Chinese, it's also Altaic.
 

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Username: inquisitor
Date: 2019-06-20 17:30:54
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That's fascinating. If the western European language isolates like Basque, Etruscan, Lemnian, Rhaetian, Venetic, Pictish et al. are part of the Finno-Ugric (thus western) branch of the Ural-Altaic languages along with languages like Finnish, Estonian, and Hungarian and related to the Altaic languages (and thus eastern) such as "Turkish, Manchu, Mongolian, and even Japanese" then it would shed light on a peculiarity that has bothered me - when supposed contact began between the Roman Empire and China, the Chinese called Rome 'Daqin' which literally means 'Greater China' and is akin to the Greeks calling Italy 'Greater Greece'. Why would a great civilization like China give another equally great civilization like Rome its own name of 'China' or more specially 'Greater China' unless they were part of the same social, cultural, political, etc. continuum or sphere? It would then be possible that the lingua franca was a Ural-Altaic language. Perhaps this continuum or sphere was what enabled the spread of Manichaean religion, which at its peak existed as far west as Britain and as far east as China.

In the west it would have been supplanted by Indo-European and possibly Afro-Asiatic (Latin and Greek with the spread of Christianity; Arabic with the spread of Islam) and then Sino-Tibetan in the east. I am not familiar with Sino-Tibetan languages, so I couldn't say with any confidence what historical event(s) they might have been spread with.
 

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Username: Curiousguy
Date: 2019-06-20 18:15:27
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Very fascinating! There is so much to unpack here! Glad I could do my part, no one seemed to be bringing up Korean, Korea, and the Altaic language family in the Tartary and related hidden histories discussion till now.
 

Jim Duyer

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Username: Jim Duyer
Date: 2019-06-20 18:44:09
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Well, on that I must insert my own opinion. I lived in Japan for four years, and at one time I was semi-fluent in the language. My first wife was Korean, but spoke both Korean and Japanese, having grown up in Japan. They may have some lexical structure similarities, but that's where it ends. They are absolutely nothing like each other in spoken, written, or corpus of terms. And yes, I would agree that the Ainu language is connected quite clearly with the Finno-Ugric branch, and also with the Dene language of North America. But the ancient Japanese adopted the Jamon group of languages, didn't they?
 

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Username: Curiousguy
Date: 2019-06-20 19:32:54
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I have never heard of the Jamon language group, myself. Do you mean the Jomon? They likely spoke either Ainu or a relative of Manchu (Tungusic language family) which is also Altaic, modern Japanese people are formed from the intermingling of the Yayoi (Language unknown, beyond proto-Japonic) and Jomon. Yes, lexical structure similarities, that's all I said. The "Goguryeo numerals" (old Korean) are also taken by some to suggest a relationship between the languages due to their similarity to numerals in Old Japanese.

This paper also suggests words with shared origins (occupation is a factor considered, don't worry.) OhioLINK ETD: Francis-Ratte, Alexander Takenobu
 

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Username: Japod
Date: 2019-06-20 19:42:29
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Those look a lot like Croatian traditional tattoos
 

Jim Duyer

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Username: Jim Duyer
Date: 2019-06-20 19:43:32
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Ha Ha -yes, another example of my fingers misspelling words. Jomon, as far as I know, was the indigenous language of southern Japan - the island of Honshu.
Yes, it seems that your suggestion about the Goguryeo numerals would mean, at the very least, that both groups (ancient Korea and the natives of Japan) adopted the same source for their naming of numbers. Interestingly, did they not have the zero?
Have you ever found an explanation of one of Alan Wilson's translations? As in, an example that he furnishes that gives the etymology of the word, the root, and its cognant form in another language, such as English, Welsh, or Gaelic? I have seen some of his results, but never any of his methods or explanations. I would like to better understand his work, but this has been a stumbling block towards my belief in his assumptions.
 

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Username: Curiousguy
Date: 2019-06-20 19:56:24
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The Jomon were an indigenous people, not a language. They merged with incoming Yayoi peoples who crossed from the Korean Peninsula to form modern Japanese peoples. It seems so, no Zero. By the way, what did you think of the paper on shared ancient word origins?
 

Jim Duyer

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Username: Jim Duyer
Date: 2019-06-20 21:05:55
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It appears to be an excellent study on the subject; but then again, I am a much better Semiotician than a Linguist. How about this - perhaps they share a common ancestor in a language that is related to both the Altai and the people who mixed with the North Europeans many thousands of years ago? So we have this unknown group (who I believe is from the Polar region) mixing with the Native Americans, the Europeans, the Siberians/Altai peoples, and the Japanese/Korean natives? This same group left footprints of DNA in all of those areas, and thus it seems possible to me. And as to the Ainu, we probably should compare them more closely with the Basque, or their source language - that of Aquatainian/Occitians?
 

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Username: Curiousguy
Date: 2019-06-21 03:30:07
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Well Finno-Uralic is a branch(subgroup) of Altai, but maybe there's some truth to your idea, hard to say.
Also, Korea wrote much like Japan (using repurposed Chinese Alphabet. Until very recently, wanting to rid themselves of Colonial history by inventing their own Alphabet, considered genius and the simplest writing system in the world (complicating things isn't always better.) , many suggests it actually draws the position the mouth and tongue should make to pronounce the words. Known as Chosŏn'gŭl (North Korea) or Hangul/Hangeul (South Korea.) depends.
 

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Username: anadentone
Date: 2019-07-19 07:25:18
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I did some more digging and this was taken from a newspaper's religious section from Indiana, Pennsylvania May 2, 1984. Where it mentions names for Satan in other languages.

Screenshot from 2019-07-19 02-42-46.png
Now, this paper says the Tartarian word for Satan is "drof". Wiki dictionary list drof as coming from Middle English. One of the origins that the word comes from is "Proto-Germanic" Drobuz. The Wiki dictionary for those places, mentions Frisian, Old Dutch, and dialectal, Swedish.One news paper article states that the Tartarian language is "Mandchu"(The article was talking about the Bible being translated into Tartarian and "Mandchu is meant"as an alternative name of the language.
 

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Username: Beanieboo111
Date: 2019-07-19 11:53:39
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Wow. Now I have an explanation why Russian old swords and helmets as well as royal hats are covered in what appears to be Arabic language. No one thought of the language as being tartarian.
 

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Username: Curiousguy
Date: 2019-07-19 18:10:41
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My video was claimed, so here's this. Works even better because of the lyrics.

 

_harris

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Username: 0harris0
Date: 2019-09-12 11:03:59
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obviously, time will tell buttttttt here's a thought:

those Turkish guys translating the Voynich manuscript... they say it's a form of old turkish speech, with an unknown alphabet! original Turkish doesn't have it's own alphabet, they just use arabic or hebrew characters!

so maybe that "old turkish" of the turkic people, the language that didn't have it's "own alphabet"... could it be from the tartarian language and, therefore, the writing in the Voynich represents the tartarian alphabet?

they did say it seems to be written in rhyme and meter.. which kinda sounds like the descriptions in those old articles!
 

Jim Duyer

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Username: Jim Duyer
Date: 2019-09-12 16:22:19
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But the people of the Anatolia peninsula, modern Turkey, did indeed have their own alphabet, and one that was probably first used prior to the Sumerians/Egyptians writings. We find only a few characters that have been released, but there are very probably more that are being kept from us. I am speaking of the site at Gobekli Tepi. One of the shards of pottery had three characters on it. They are from an alphabet that later became the Cuneiform of the Sumerians. And it says, very clearly, "flood." Whether this was a large flood, a local flood or just the fear of a possible flood we can not know for sure with the data that we have. But yes, they did have this skill. I was able to trace the characters to a later template for Paleo-Hebrew, which in itself forms a part of the Sumerian language. Or, in other words, I was able to use Paleo-Hebrew with a template that I have devised to translate the Gobekli Tepi characters, and then use those to find the words in the Sumerian language lexicon. So, again, this was one of the examples that I was speaking of, where someone can, has, and can again, translate an unknown language without a Rosetta stone. Context, or a longer text source, would have provided me with the answers to the question about which flood or how big, but the timeline we know, (8000 BC or so) and the general theme we know. Now we just need to get the scholars to release more of what they have uncovered.
 

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Username: 0harris0
Date: 2019-09-12 21:02:42
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@Starmonkey w.t.f!?! o_Oo_Oo_O
completely
forgot about that tune.. flashback or what!!
got me good there!!
 

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Username: MaybeLater
Date: 2019-09-29 02:05:29
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Is it wrong to say, "Blast from the Past" here?
 

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Username: CryoApple
Date: 2019-11-24 07:58:28
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These are apparently faked, but it is still interesting to see that certain selections of letters can be read upside down. This is a good example of what we could be looking for.
tav_rep6.jpg
Unnamed3332.jpgUnnamwwwed3.jpg

If you look carefully you can see that the 'arrow ->' and 'k' looking letters can be turned multi-directional, giving a cipher like appearance. I have to give him credit, he is a pretty talented lad.

screenshot-www.innsmouthfreepress.com-2019.11.24-18_37_50.jpg

Not to get off-track, but these tablets remind me alot of the Voynich Manuscript, if that means anything at all.
Unnamed3338.jpg
 
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